SILLY SEASON TRANSFER RUMOURS 20/21

First topic message reminder :

GeordieFalcon wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:I think Schoeman has been injured for nearly all his time at Bath. Can play 10 and 15 though.

Chiefs look set to sign Leinster second row Dunne a 6ft8 122kg 21 year old for next season. Hasn't played this season yet due to an ankle injury. Replacement for one of the outgoing internationals it seems.

Just what we need!

At least your youngsters will get lots of game time.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Dan Thomas will join Scarlets on a 2 week loan. It sounds like Bristol are signing someone EQ in the back-row?

Bristol haven't got a game for two weeks and if I remember rightly then Dan Thomas has been injured and could do with the game time.

There are rumours that this may turn into a season long loan for us.

Then you can get the Argentinian off your books.

Oakdene wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Dan Thomas will join Scarlets on a 2 week loan. It sounds like Bristol are signing someone EQ in the back-row?

Bristol haven't got a game for two weeks and if I remember rightly then Dan Thomas has been injured and could do with the game time.

There are rumours that this may turn into a season long loan for us.

Longer than that

mikey_dragon wrote:Then you can get the Argentinian off your books.

He needs to go as he is constantly injured which is a shame as he has looked good in short spells.

PhilBB wrote:

Oakdene wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Dan Thomas will join Scarlets on a 2 week loan. It sounds like Bristol are signing someone EQ in the back-row?

Bristol haven't got a game for two weeks and if I remember rightly then Dan Thomas has been injured and could do with the game time.

There are rumours that this may turn into a season long loan for us.

Longer than that

Apparently he still works on the family farm and that is out Scarlets way and where he wants to be post rugby so a move to Scarlets would be ideal for him and the family.

Any truth in the Odogwu to Benetton rumour? I didn't know he qualified for Italy. Decent 13/wing.

I can well see it being true. He's been patient after being in the England squad but he's been dropped and not in again since his injury. A much better centre than winger for me but doesn't appear on Jones' radar and I think he'd be class for Italy.

Big fan of Odogwu and think Jones is missing out not looking at him more......but then the fact he's omitted Ollie Lawrence also tells its own story.

Especially with the vague dream of Manu actually staying fit.

Could very well be facing England in the 6n.

Odogwu is to hit and miss for international level, I think he'd get pulled out of position and exploited at 13 and isn't good enough in the air for back three. Perhaps had he had better luck with injuries he could have fixed those aspects with more game time but hasn't come to fruition yet.

Rumours circling that Tigers are to announce Jack Willis and Charlie Atkinson, I'll believe it when I see it but with Hegarty injured and then leaving early we should have his spare cap to fit their artificially low salaries in.

Article in the weekend's papers reported that Launchbury had been offered just £60k (he was previously on £400k) to play the rest of the season at a Prem side (not named but presumably Quins) and another unnamed Wasps young first teamer's best offer was an academy contract (I presume they meant development as in under 24). Seems that there really is bargains to be had.

Not sure on timelines for injuries - But Quins could probably do with some injury cover in the back row and 2nd row! (I am not sure if injury cover has to come under the salary cap)

Dombrandt, Lewies, Chisholm, Lawday all out at the same time.
And Either of the Willis boys would be good, or Barbeary (but he's currently injured too)
You can understand why Launchbury would also be a great addition.

propdavid_london wrote:Not sure on timelines for injuries - But Quins could probably do with some injury cover in the back row and 2nd row! (I am not sure if injury cover has to come under the salary cap)

Dombrandt, Lewies, Chisholm, Lawday all out at the same time.  
And Either of the Willis boys would be good, or Barbeary (but he's currently injured too)
You can understand why Launchbury would also be a great addition.  

Apparently Dombrandt could be back as early as next week. Quins could probably still do with some back row cover - but yesterday’s game showed that they’ve found a different way to play without relying on their missing ball carriers.

propdavid_london wrote:Not sure on timelines for injuries - But Quins could probably do with some injury cover in the back row and 2nd row! (I am not sure if injury cover has to come under the salary cap)
 

There used to be a separate injury dispensation pot for players who missed more than 12 weeks through injury. I presume this is still the case and Bristol have used it to sign Batley and Porter as cover for the injured Jeffries and Randall.

The Willis boys are being linked with Ulster and Bristol/Tigers respectively. Barbeary with a move to France (a great idea for him). Given it's Lawday and Chisholm you are missing then Brad Shields would be the more like for like replacement in terms of work rate and particularly hitting rucks. Launchbury has been an ongoing rumour for a while but if the paper reports are true and £60k is all that's being offered it might be tough for him and his family to take the step down in earnings unless there's another deal forthcoming from the summer onwards that is offering a lot more security.

Its a tough time for a lot of very good players.
Which is why I was wondering if its better for players to be signed on as injury cover at the moment rather than full contracts!

propdavid_london wrote:Its a tough time for a lot of very good players.  
Which is why I was wondering if its better for players to be signed on as injury cover at the moment rather than full contracts!

I'd expect nearly all that sign with a Prem club to sign until the end of the season and then renegotiate for next season onwards. Injury dispensation is probably preferable as it's a limited amount outside of the cap so there's more leeway for a club to offer a better salary. The glut of players available make good salaries unlikely though.

So big Wilco Louw off to the Bulls. Quins will miss him i imagine. IS that to create space for Launchbury contract?

Geordie wrote:So big Wilco Louw off to the Bulls. Quins will miss him i imagine. IS that to create space for Launchbury contract?

I actually wouldn't be surprised if Quins had cap space. They lost Symons and Tizard replacing with Herbst and Matthews at lock alone.

Esterhuizen, Smith and Marler will be big contracts but Esterhuizen presumably marquee. Louw, Dombrandt, Care and Marchant in the bracket below that of being well paid but likely not huge contracts.

Their backs especially I look at and see a lot of good value though due to players being young and developing. Green, Lynagh, Murley, Northmore, etc. Those are fantastic players but wont yet be on big deals.

In the forwards there are a lot of strong Premiership players just below international standard who tend to be great value. Marler aside the tight five is basically made of those players. Chisholm and White in the back row. Due to injuries Will Evans might be in that bracket now too. He's a fantastic openside but shouldn't be on a huge deal. Kenningham is young hence should offer value.

Overall it looks a small squad but one full of quality, versatile and vitally young players so shouldn't be bank breaking.

Geordie wrote:So big Wilco Louw off to the Bulls. Quins will miss him i imagine. IS that to create space for Launchbury contract?

When Collier is fit he's second choice. I doubt he's cheap. Making some space to get Launchbury and another decent tighthead in would make the squad stronger overall. Ryan or McCallum would be be cost effective alternatives, not as good as Louw but as squad options go they are both available now.

KC it's worth noting that Marcus Smith is due a new contract next summer and rumours are he wants a deal in line with the likes of Ford and Farrell which is a jump up from his current earnings.

On the Launchbury rumours I believe I saw somewhere that someone involved at Quins rubbished those rumours? Might mean nothing of course!

Is Launchbury still London based? He's got 2 kids and a third on the way so probably keen to keep family where they are if possible.

Given Isiekwe is out long term enough for injury dispensation I honestly though Sarries might look at him short term. Would be a good way to cover for Itoje and Tizard as well if both are involved with England.

formerly known as Sam wrote:KC it's worth noting that Marcus Smith is due a new contract next summer and rumours are he wants a deal in line with the likes of Ford and Farrell which is a jump up from his current earnings.

Probably shifts him into the marquee spot with Esterhuizen then in the cap. Smith's issue will be that if he moves anywhere else in the Prem he can't be marquee but if he left wouldn't get England payments though. So a compromise there will almost certainly be found.

With fewer clubs in the Premiership, 1 marquee and the cap going back up potentially being delayed I think wages will keep coming down as a whole though. The wage inflation of a few years ago was really culled by covid. That's only going to keep coming down I think.

Geordie wrote:So big Wilco Louw off to the Bulls. Quins will miss him i imagine. IS that to create space for Launchbury contract?

Good player, really good signing for Bulls in an area they were already very strong. Louw was around the Springboks squad for the Lions I think? He's probably joining a few others in going back to help the international ambitions.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Geordie wrote:So big Wilco Louw off to the Bulls. Quins will miss him i imagine. IS that to create space for Launchbury contract?

Good player, really good signing for Bulls in an area they were already very strong. Louw was around the Springboks squad for the Lions I think? He's probably joining a few others in going back to help the international ambitions.

Bit of that but I also suspect a lot of Prem teams are offering lower wages than they were before so staying in England is less profitable for him than it used to be and the Bulls have good funding don't they?

Hills with Bath then.

Yes a long term contract. Not too far away from Worcester, should be able to fight for a spot.

I notice Bath have also had approval for their Stadium to be completely renovated...

Geordie wrote:Yes a long term contract. Not too far away from Worcester, should be able to fight for a spot.

I notice Bath have also had approval for their Stadium to be completely renovated...

Pleased with that, at one point thought he was holding out for a slot at a club elsewhere. Bath are starting to get a pretty physical pack with a couple of huge SA props plus Stuart and Obano when fit. Attwood and Roux in second row and now Hill with Underhill and Coetzee to come back plus some very quick backrowers in Reid Bayliss and de Carpienter. I have now tempted fate with several to now be injured....
The Rec will be pulled down not renovated with a 18k seated stadium clad in Bath stone and bars/shops with lots of glass facing the river and hopefully a state of the arts hybrid pitch.
https://grimshaw.global/projects/sport/bath-rugby/

Looks very smart - there are no court appeals now holding it up. It just now needs to be built and with all the logistical problems and headaches that go with it, both for the club and the team operating around it. Fingers crossed.

Looks like it'll be a lovely stadium. Shame only 18k, I suspect a firing Bath side could attract more through the gates than that. Just glad for the city the wrangling appears to be finally over.

I imagine Hill will replace Coetzee won't he? Coetzee having spent most of his time at Bath injured probably won't be offered a new deal.

king_carlos wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:KC it's worth noting that Marcus Smith is due a new contract next summer and rumours are he wants a deal in line with the likes of Ford and Farrell which is a jump up from his current earnings.

Probably shifts him into the marquee spot with Esterhuizen then in the cap. Smith's issue will be that if he moves anywhere else in the Prem he can't be marquee but if he left wouldn't get England payments though. So a compromise there will almost certainly be found.

With fewer clubs in the Premiership, 1 marquee and the cap going back up potentially being delayed I think wages will keep coming down as a whole though. The wage inflation of a few years ago was really culled by covid. That's only going to keep coming down I think.

Quins will almost certainly have done long term planning based on building the club around Smith; and for Smith it makes little sense to go anywhere else while he's in England's plan and probably not much sense to go anywhere else while he's still in his prime. There'll be some dancing around salary, but neither side wants to move.

I could see him doing a Tommy Allan once a long term England replacement comes through and going somewhere he can earn a nice wage while sharing the duties. And I could see him doing a Wilkinson and going to an ambitious foreign club where they'll build a side around him. But I can't see him moving within the English system as long as he's fit, in form and ahead of his rivals for the England shirt.

formerly known as Sam wrote:Looks like it'll be a lovely stadium. Shame only 18k, I suspect a firing Bath side could attract more through the gates than that. Just glad for the city the wrangling appears to be finally over.

I imagine Hill will replace Coetzee won't he? Coetzee having spent most of his time at Bath injured probably won't be offered a new deal.

There was a lot of chat about the proposed 18k capacity when the plans first came out. Part of the issue is height of the stands bring restricted due to other heritage buildings around the site. I have no doubt they will fill it and the ticket prices will go up accordingly. A west country derby ticket for an average non-season ticket seat is about £70!! which makes a season ticket a bargain.

No talk about Coetzee yet, he arrived with a lot of fanfare but has been blighted with some terrible injuries. Faletau has not been replaced, so would have thought there would be budget. VG must be on the look out for a test FH as his priority. Worboys did pretty well on the weekend though.

Poorfour wrote:

king_carlos wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:KC it's worth noting that Marcus Smith is due a new contract next summer and rumours are he wants a deal in line with the likes of Ford and Farrell which is a jump up from his current earnings.

Probably shifts him into the marquee spot with Esterhuizen then in the cap. Smith's issue will be that if he moves anywhere else in the Prem he can't be marquee but if he left wouldn't get England payments though. So a compromise there will almost certainly be found.

With fewer clubs in the Premiership, 1 marquee and the cap going back up potentially being delayed I think wages will keep coming down as a whole though. The wage inflation of a few years ago was really culled by covid. That's only going to keep coming down I think.

Quins will almost certainly have done long term planning based on building the club around Smith; and for Smith it makes little sense to go anywhere else while he's in England's plan and probably not much sense to go anywhere else while he's still in his prime. There'll be some dancing around salary, but neither side wants to move.

I could see him doing a Tommy Allan once a long term England replacement comes through and going somewhere he can earn a nice wage while sharing the duties. And I could see him doing a Wilkinson and going to an ambitious foreign club where they'll build a side around him. But I can't see him moving within the English system as long as he's fit, in form and ahead of his rivals for the England shirt.

Oh I'm sure they'll thrash out a deal but Smith will want an uplift and for Quins to show a bit of love which I'm sure they will.

Recwatcher16 wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:Looks like it'll be a lovely stadium. Shame only 18k, I suspect a firing Bath side could attract more through the gates than that. Just glad for the city the wrangling appears to be finally over.

I imagine Hill will replace Coetzee won't he? Coetzee having spent most of his time at Bath injured probably won't be offered a new deal.

There was a lot of chat about the proposed 18k capacity when the plans first came out. Part of the issue is height of the stands bring restricted due to other heritage buildings around the site. I have no doubt they will fill it and the ticket prices will go up accordingly. A west country derby ticket for an average non-season ticket seat is about £70!! which makes a season ticket a bargain.

No talk about Coetzee yet, he arrived with a lot of fanfare but has been blighted with some terrible injuries. Faletau has not been replaced, so would have thought there would be budget. VG must be on the look out for a test FH as his priority. Worboys did pretty well on the weekend though.

With Bailey coming through along with Worboys it's probably cheaper to develop them and look for a solid Prem level support option. Searle is a handy squad man to have acquired.

Rumour of Vincent Koch to Sale.

Koch and Odogwu to Stadt Francais....

Yep and what's betting Odogwu heads to Italy for a cap.

Yeah...hes not going to make the England squad again i wouldnt have thought...so makes sense if he wants international recognition.

Biggar has signed for Toulon for the rest of the season, with immediate effect.

Is that just Northampton getting their bill down?

Oakdene wrote:Biggar has signed for Toulon for the rest of the season, with immediate effect.

Did not see that one coming

Part of me wonders what is going on in England, however they did sign Fin Smith and have a placeholder in Grayson so might as well save on the salary cap

Hazel Sapling wrote:

Oakdene wrote:Biggar has signed for Toulon for the rest of the season, with immediate effect.

Did not see that one coming

Part of me wonders what is going on in England, however they did sign Fin Smith and have a placeholder in Grayson so might as well save on the salary cap

Wow that's a surprise with immediate effect. Fin Smith is the long term option without a doubt but you'd have thought this season would have been the ideal opportunity for the experienced international 10 to mentor the future 10. Grayson and Furbank are perfectly passable Prem level flyhalfs but when the big games come you'd not really want either starting at 10.

This only makes sense of Saints are freeing up cap to reinforce more of the squad from the available pool of Wasps and Wuss talent.

Recwatcher16 wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:Looks like it'll be a lovely stadium. Shame only 18k, I suspect a firing Bath side could attract more through the gates than that. Just glad for the city the wrangling appears to be finally over.

I imagine Hill will replace Coetzee won't he? Coetzee having spent most of his time at Bath injured probably won't be offered a new deal.

There was a lot of chat about the proposed 18k capacity when the plans first came out. Part of the issue is height of the stands bring restricted due to other heritage buildings around the site. I have no doubt they will fill it and the ticket prices will go up accordingly. A west country derby ticket for an average non-season ticket seat is about £70!! which makes a season ticket a bargain.

No talk about Coetzee yet, he arrived with a lot of fanfare but has been blighted with some terrible injuries. Faletau has not been replaced, so would have thought there would be budget. VG must be on the look out for a test FH as his priority. Worboys did pretty well on the weekend though.

Finn Russell?

Charlie Atkinson and Wasps defence coach Matt Everard join Tigers. Atkinson is a like for like replacement for Hegarty who is leaving early to go back to Australia and Everard will join the academy coaching set up.

Decent back up option.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Decent back up option.

Decent back up now but could develop into more given he's only recently turned 21. Covers 10 and 15, useful player. With Burns not getting any younger (33 by the end of the season) and linked with a return to Japan next summer it makes a lot of sense.

Lee Blackett is likely to join Scarlets as assistant to Dwayne Peel.

That's a great signing. For the rest of the season I believe, with the possibility he then goes back to Wasps.

Oakdene wrote:Lee Blackett is likely to join Scarlets as assistant to Dwayne Peel.

Good signing, Dwayne needs help!

mikey_dragon wrote:

Oakdene wrote:Lee Blackett is likely to join Scarlets as assistant to Dwayne Peel.

Good signing, Dwayne needs help!

This is the trouble Dwanye is filling in as a backs coach at the moment so not focussing on being a head coach so hopefully this will help him....

Lee Blackett is meant to be joining as head coach. It might be better if him and Dwayne switched around; Blackett as head coach and Peel as backs coach...

mikey_dragon wrote:Lee Blackett is meant to be joining as head coach. It might be better if him and Dwayne switched around; Blackett as head coach and Peel as backs coach...

Not sure on that, he is replacing Dai F as far as I am aware....

Sorry, I meant joining as backs coach. He would be my choice for head coach though...

mikey_dragon wrote:Sorry, I meant joining as backs coach. He would be my choice for head coach though...

Ah sorry I see what you mean, I agree in a way but lets hope he gets a lot of work done in this training block before the next round of games....lots to be done.