Re: England Getting Four Wins in the Six Nations - A New Thread

[Geordie]

First topic message reminder :

2 tries for Hartley at 12 .

Fdjour decent first scrum then missed some tackles etc.
Sales two wingers Reed and Roebuck were very impressive....

Bath v Cardiff now...lots of potential England options here.

[Geordie]

Apparently the squad will be announced on January 18th.

Waiting for injury updates etc?

[No 7&1/2]

That's the 6 nations squad ain't it? Today should still be the extended one?

[No 7&1/2]

Sinfield is off then. Good news is that it is finally confirmed that we keep some consistency and Wigglesworth will continue to oversee the attack.

Beeb:

'Kevin Sinfield will leave the England coaching team later this year, says head coach Steve Borthwick.

Defence coach Sinfield has been Borthwick's right-hand man since he left Leicester to take up the England job at the end of 2022.

But he will move on from the England setup following the Six Nations and summer tour of Japan and New Zealand.

"Kev is absolutely committed to the team over the next period," Borthwick said.

Borthwick has brought in former All Blacks coach Andrew Strawbridge for the Six Nations as part of a reshuffled backroom team.

Felix Jones, who has joined England after winning two World Cups with South Africa, has been confirmed as defence coach.

Sinfield has moved to coaching individual skills and kicking.

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England begin their campaign against Italy in Rome on 2 February, with Borthwick hoping Strawbridge can bring another dimension to his side's attacking game.

"Andrew is another coach with a wealth of knowledge," Borthwick added.

"He has worked extensively and successfully in Super Rugby and international rugby, most recently with New Zealand to help them to the final of the 2023 Rugby World Cup.

"Andrew has an incredible reputation in player development and has helped a large number of players progress to be amongst the best in the world.

"His work around the contact area is incredibly highly regarded, ensuring teams have the quick ball needed to launch a threatening attack.

"I can't wait for him to join the team and add the enormous value that I know he will bring."

Borthwick will confirm his England squad for the Six Nations on 17 January.

Jones' arrival means a change in role for Sinfield, who has been in charge of the England defence since a the end of 2022.

"I am tremendously excited to start working with Felix who is a coach with an incredible reputation and with vast experience in international rugby," said Borthwick.

"With his background in Irish rugby and his wealth of knowledge operating in the southern hemisphere, he will bring a different dimension to our coaching team."

Richard Wigglesworth will continue to run the England attack, with Tom Harrison overseeing the scrum.'

[Geordie]

SO

Felix Jones confirmed as Defence Coach
Kevin Sinfield moves to Skills and Kicking coach
Andrew Strawbridge (ex-All Blacks skills consultant) on a short term deal (first 4 weeks of the 6N) focusing on the breakdown
Wigglesworth remains as Attack Coach
Tom Harrison remains as Scrum Coach

[Poorfour]

Well, at least that gives some clarity. I'd heard and hoped that Jones would be rummimg the attack. A bit less inspiring to have Wigglesworth stay in that role.

[doctor_grey]

Well, at least that gives some clarity. I'd heard and hoped that Jones would be rummimg the attack. A bit less inspiring to have Wigglesworth stay in that role.

At least all our scrum halves will have lots more practice kicking possession away.

I wonder if this creates a professional opportunity for me. Kicking balls high in the air is not a natural function in the groin and potentially the knee, the same as pitching a baseball is not natural for the shoulder or elbow (somewhat less so for a Cricket bowler with the elbow mostly straight). Wiggly staying in that position might be the final piece of the puzzle so I can buy a Porsche....

[dummy_half]

Well, at least that gives some clarity. I'd heard and hoped that Jones would be rummimg the attack. A bit less inspiring to have Wigglesworth stay in that role.

At least all our scrum halves will have lots more practice kicking possession away.  

I wonder if this creates a professional opportunity for me.  Kicking balls high in the air is not a natural function in the groin and potentially the knee, the same as pitching a baseball is not natural for the shoulder or elbow (somewhat less so for a Cricket bowler with the elbow mostly straight).  Wiggly staying in that position might be the final piece of the puzzle so I can buy a Porsche....  

Do that many international (in particular English) scrum halfs travel to the States for medical procedures?

[Geordie]

Well, at least that gives some clarity. I'd heard and hoped that Jones would be rummimg the attack. A bit less inspiring to have Wigglesworth stay in that role.

At least all our scrum halves will have lots more practice kicking possession away.  

I wonder if this creates a professional opportunity for me.  Kicking balls high in the air is not a natural function in the groin and potentially the knee, the same as pitching a baseball is not natural for the shoulder or elbow (somewhat less so for a Cricket bowler with the elbow mostly straight).  Wiggly staying in that position might be the final piece of the puzzle so I can buy a Porsche....  

No Sinfield is kicking coach now

[No 7&1/2]

It does sound a little bit like busy work for Sinfield until after the summer?

[mountain man]

So no squad announcement today then it seems.

[formerly known as Sam]

It does sound a little bit like busy work for Sinfield until after the summer?

To be fair he was a very good kicker off the tee in his day.

Seems an odd call given how much our defence improved at the world cup whereas our attack continued to struggle.

I did hear a rumour that Sinfield wanted to spend more time at home and that the international periods meant he was away from extended periods. Hopefully he's heading back to Tigers so we can switch Everard to attack coach as ours is currently on a leave of absence.

[No 7&1/2]

Borthwick has confirmed he's attempting to get Feyi-Waboso to choose england. Also interested in Roots at Exeter.

[doctor_grey]

So no squad announcement today then it seems.

Perhaps the issue with the RPA has an impact on selection???

[Duty281]

Feyi-Waboso, how does he qualify for England, Cardiff born, lived most of his life in Wales up until a couple of years ago, Nigerian parents, where is the English connection?

He qualifies for England selection 'through his father', according to The Telegraph, although I have previously heard that he had Nigerian parents.

[doctor_grey]

Feyi-Waboso, how does he qualify for England, Cardiff born, lived most of his life in Wales up until a couple of years ago, Nigerian parents, where is the English connection?

He qualifies for England selection 'through his father', according to The Telegraph, although I have previously heard that he had Nigerian parents.

Funny enough, I wouldn't want him anywhere but Wales.  Just listen to him talk. With an accent like his, there is nowhere but Wales.

[No 7&1/2]

Mako wants a word.

[mountain man]

Have you heard Hamish Watson speak? Not sure we should base eligibility on accent but I agree, given all considerations he "should" play for Wales but if he ends up playing for England so be it.

[formerly known as Sam]

Have you heard Hamish Watson speak? Not sure we should base eligibility on accent but I agree, given all considerations he "should" play for Wales but if he ends up playing for England so be it.

Despite having a Scottish name Hamish Watson was born in Manchester, grew up in Cheshire before moving to Leicestershire and then coming through the Tigers academy. Qualified for Scotland through his parents.

I'd agree that accents can't dictate where you play, especially because I've known some people who quickly pick up bits from wherever they live giving very amusing mixed.

[Poorfour]

Peter Schmeichel's adoption of the glottal stop always amused me...

For a young player starting out, you can't begrudge them looking at any options on offer. It's a short, uncertain career. I know three kids with credible international prospects, who between them are qualified for England, Scotland, Wales, Canada, Japan and possibly Ireland. If any of them make it, I'd celebrate regardless of who they played for.

[Geordie]

Peter Schmeichel's adoption of the glottal stop always amused me...

For a young player starting out, you can't begrudge them looking at any options on offer. It's a short, uncertain career. I know three kids with credible international prospects, who between them are qualified for England, Scotland, Wales, Canada, Japan and possibly Ireland. If any of them make it, I'd celebrate regardless of who they played for.

Ill raise you Jan Molby.....

[mikey_dragon]

Feyi-Waboso, how does he qualify for England, Cardiff born, lived most of his life in Wales up until a couple of years ago, Nigerian parents, where is the English connection?

He qualifies for England selection 'through his father', according to The Telegraph, although I have previously heard that he had Nigerian parents.

Funny enough, I wouldn't want him anywhere but Wales.  Just listen to him talk.  With an accent like his, there is nowhere but Wales.

Maybe bringing him right now is too soon? I don't know, but would prefer him to have one full season playing for Exeter in the premiership. LRZ we couldn't ignore, as he became top try-scorer and was still 19 and I doubt Feyi-Waboso is that good. All write-ups are mostly positive though.

[Geordie]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/other/england-rugby-stars-to-ditch-players-union-to-make-future-deals-with-rfu/ar-AA1msWcZ

So A new Team England Rugby Ltd Formed by Genge, Goerge, Itoje, Marler and Watson will handle the contract and commercial negotiations with the RFU....

Those above are listed as the directors...

[mikey_dragon]

Lance Bradly is now CEO of Ospreys. He was formerly Glaws CEO but also held other positions here and there. Is he any good? WOL are talking him up so it could be complete drivel.

[carpet baboon]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/other/england-rugby-stars-to-ditch-players-union-to-make-future-deals-with-rfu/ar-AA1msWcZ

So A new Team England Rugby Ltd Formed by Genge, Goerge, Itoje, Marler and Watson will handle the contract and commercial negotiations with the RFU....

Those above are listed as the directors...

I assume they will be employing someone with a background in these sort of things rather than actually dealing with it themselves?

Wonder what cut they get

[No 7&1/2]

Farrell to Racing then. It makes the capping of Smith a little more urgent though it would be my top priority 9f I were the coach.

[doctor_grey]

To me, Farrell to France, and Racing in particular, if true, makes a lot of sense. They would give him a strong support staff and have a strong team around him. He is past his prime and this seems an excellent opportunity for him.

[mountain man]

Racing deny it. Statement issued.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67896635

[Rugby Fan]

Although Racing have denied interest, it might not be a terrible idea for Farrell to move to France.

Wilkinson never inspired the same outright hostility but plenty of England fans thought he was a busted flush, and didn't want him anywhere near the Test team for the 2011 World Cup.

Wilkinson's reputation was almost completely rehabilitated by his activities with Toulon. He won major titles, and virtually all the global superstars playing alongside gave him credit for driving standards in that team. Gatland was even prepared to let him play out Toulon's season, and join the 2013 Lions squad later than everyone else.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

Have you heard Hamish Watson speak? Not sure we should base eligibility on accent but I agree, given all considerations he "should" play for Wales but if he ends up playing for England so be it.

Even more well known, Ian McGeechan, born in Leeds played for Headingly all his club playing career. Only qualified for Scotland through his father, Mum was English.

"So A new Team England Rugby Ltd Formed by Genge, Goerge, Itoje, Marler and Watson will handle the contract and commercial negotiations with the RFU..."

Must be the Goerge bloke, all the rest are rugby players

[No 7&1/2]

Racing have denied it was agreed but does sound as if they're discussing it.

[Rugby Fan]

The players' rejection of the RPA is a story no-one has really fleshed out.

The RPA recently won arbitration for the England players to receive match fees for the 3rd place play-off, which see some pundits see as evidence the RPA stands up for them. It could be argued to the original contract negotiations were poor, if that payment had to be litigated.

Still, as Brian Moore points out, the RPA needs funding for the work it does. Without fees from the England squad to some programmes will have to be cut.

[mountain man]

I wonder was it a condition in the hybrid contract that they leave RPA?

[No 7&1/2]

You'll know I thinknhes stuck in the dark ages with his tactics and has for some reason got baby coaches with him but if this turns out to be true then bloody well done Borthwick.

Alex Bywater:Exclusive: Immanuel Feyi-Waboso will join up with an ???????????????????????? senior squad for the first time as part of a Six Nations 'alignment camp' this week. He won’t play for ???????????????????????? in the 2024 Championship.

[No 7&1/2]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

[TAFKA The Oracle]

If he’s not passionate and motivated to play for Wales then I don’t want him (playing for Wales). I wish him all the best though. A great looking prospect.

[No 7&1/2]

They can't all be like Tompkins who got told he had a Welsh granny by the Welsh coaches.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

Isn't he okay to play for Wales and Exeter as he signed for Chiefs prior to being capped or brought into the squad. He would have to go to a Welsh club when his contract ran out with Chiefs.

[TAFKA The Oracle]

My point simply was that I only want people who actually want to play for Wales. Got nothing against players qualifying for other nations through residency or family history, etc. I’m not going to be up in arms about this one, was my point, as it sounds like he doesn’t want to play for Wales anyway.

On a separate note, I do wonder if the 25 cap rule played a big part here. Under the rule, he’d need to sign for a Welsh club during his uni degree. So maybe he didn’t want to risk his uni qualifications. And I can’t blame him for that. Often future career aspirations are far more important that passing and kicking a bag of wind about a pitch. Can’t blame him for that. So again, I wish him all the best

[TAFKA The Oracle]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

Isn't he okay to play for Wales and Exeter as he signed for Chiefs prior to being capped or brought into the squad. He would have to go to a Welsh club when his contract ran out with Chiefs.

Yeah, but he’s doing a long degree so would risk having to sign for a Welsh team half way through the course. Not worth risking it.

Seen some ridiculous comments on Twitter saying the WRU should have stepped in and forced Cardiff uni to offer him a place. Wtf?! Laughable!

[TAFKA The Oracle]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

I failed to see this post originally and have written pretty the same myself. Twice! Not sure how I missed this one 7.5! But yes, seems the 25 cap rule had an impact.

[No 7&1/2]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

Isn't he okay to play for Wales and Exeter as he signed for Chiefs prior to being capped or brought into the squad. He would have to go to a Welsh club when his contract ran out with Chiefs.

Yes the quote around it is suggesting it's when his next contract comes up as it would then impact the course. He seems to like Exeter.

[mikey_dragon]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

Isn't he okay to play for Wales and Exeter as he signed for Chiefs prior to being capped or brought into the squad. He would have to go to a Welsh club when his contract ran out with Chiefs.

Yeah, but he’s doing a long degree so would risk having to sign for a Welsh team half way through the course. Not worth risking it.

Seen some ridiculous comments on Twitter saying the WRU should have stepped in and forced Cardiff uni to offer him a place. Wtf?! Laughable!

Is there any reason why pro rugby can’t help him get a place at uni? Plenty of English teams do it for their players. Now he’s off elsewhere because the Welsh teams don’t have strong enough links with schools and universities.

[No 7&1/2]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

Isn't he okay to play for Wales and Exeter as he signed for Chiefs prior to being capped or brought into the squad. He would have to go to a Welsh club when his contract ran out with Chiefs.

Yeah, but he’s doing a long degree so would risk having to sign for a Welsh team half way through the course. Not worth risking it.

Seen some ridiculous comments on Twitter saying the WRU should have stepped in and forced Cardiff uni to offer him a place. Wtf?! Laughable!

Is there any reason why pro rugby can’t help him get a place at uni? Plenty of English teams do it for their players. Now he’s off elsewhere because the Welsh teams don’t have strong enough links with schools and universities.

Which england teams are fixing courses to ensure that people with the required academic scores are prevented from a place so a sportsman can take it instead?

[WELL-PAST-IT]

I know nothing about the Welsh uni system, how many universities run good medical courses? If it is not many, there will be high demand, those without the A* s are going to struggle.

There should really be some sort of dispensation for cases such as his, by all countries. They are asking him to forget getting a degree, certainly a medical degree so he can play for Wales. With the salaries and match money players, even good ones get in Wales, they need an after rugby career which it seems the Welsh education system does not always provide. If he gets injured in mid twenties and he has nothing to fall back on, no-brainer really. Well benefits England in this case.

[WELL-PAST-IT]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

Isn't he okay to play for Wales and Exeter as he signed for Chiefs prior to being capped or brought into the squad. He would have to go to a Welsh club when his contract ran out with Chiefs.

Yeah, but he’s doing a long degree so would risk having to sign for a Welsh team half way through the course. Not worth risking it.

Seen some ridiculous comments on Twitter saying the WRU should have stepped in and forced Cardiff uni to offer him a place. Wtf?! Laughable!

Is there any reason why pro rugby can’t help him get a place at uni? Plenty of English teams do it for their players. Now he’s off elsewhere because the Welsh teams don’t have strong enough links with schools and universities.

Which england teams are fixing courses to ensure that people with the required academic scores are prevented from a place so a sportsman can take it instead?

Ones with contacts to universities that have good rugby teams that want to keep them good, almost a academy feeder system.

[TAFKA The Oracle]

Cardiff Uni has a good medical school. And a good rugby team (Cardiff Medics). Not sure if he couldn’t get in there or if he wasn’t interested in studying there.

[TAFKA The Oracle]

I know nothing about the Welsh uni system, how many universities run good medical courses? If it is not many, there will be high demand, those without the A* s are going to struggle.

There should really be some sort of dispensation for cases such as his, by all countries. They are asking him to forget getting a degree, certainly a medical degree so he can play for Wales. With the salaries and match money players, even good ones get in Wales, they need an after rugby career which it seems the Welsh education system does not always provide. If he gets injured in mid twenties and he has nothing to fall back on, no-brainer really. Well benefits England in this case.

There are only 8 (I think) unis in Wales, so yes definitely limited. I think only Cardiff, maybe Swansea, offer medicine. Cardiff is certainly the top one in Wales.

[TAFKA The Oracle]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

Isn't he okay to play for Wales and Exeter as he signed for Chiefs prior to being capped or brought into the squad. He would have to go to a Welsh club when his contract ran out with Chiefs.

Yeah, but he’s doing a long degree so would risk having to sign for a Welsh team half way through the course. Not worth risking it.

Seen some ridiculous comments on Twitter saying the WRU should have stepped in and forced Cardiff uni to offer him a place. Wtf?! Laughable!

Is there any reason why pro rugby can’t help him get a place at uni? Plenty of English teams do it for their players. Now he’s off elsewhere because the Welsh teams don’t have strong enough links with schools and universities.

No reason there can’t be a relationship between eduction and sport. Not sure they can go as far as ‘stepping in’ to get someone a place. Some unis offer scholarships but it’s more to do with supporting students who are student-athletes in terms of financial support, flexibility on deadlines and attendance as they’re away playing sport, etc. Some will offer a package for good athletes to join them. But as far as I know (I work at at Welsh uni) there is no system whereby someone like a sport governing body can step in and either insist or pressure an educational establishment to offer a place for someone. Certainly not medicine. It’s all based on a) qualifications, and then for over subscribed courses such as medicine b) performance at interview.

[TAFKA The Oracle]

Edit: just read that he didn’t get the grades for Cardiff uni. So there we have it. Getting into Cardiff was a non-starter, but did sound like he wanted to stay in Wales initially. Shame, but I doubt WRU could have any sway if he didn’t even get the required grades.

[mikey_dragon]

That was a copy and paste job I haven't gone mad with question marks and black flags. First one is england the second Wales. Apparently the 25 cap rule has had a big impact on the decision as he's doing a long term medical course at Exeter uni and would mean having to leave it when he had to return to Wales (if wanting to continue playing for them).

Isn't he okay to play for Wales and Exeter as he signed for Chiefs prior to being capped or brought into the squad. He would have to go to a Welsh club when his contract ran out with Chiefs.

Yeah, but he’s doing a long degree so would risk having to sign for a Welsh team half way through the course. Not worth risking it.

Seen some ridiculous comments on Twitter saying the WRU should have stepped in and forced Cardiff uni to offer him a place. Wtf?! Laughable!

Is there any reason why pro rugby can’t help him get a place at uni? Plenty of English teams do it for their players. Now he’s off elsewhere because the Welsh teams don’t have strong enough links with schools and universities.

Which england teams are fixing courses to ensure that people with the required academic scores are prevented from a place so a sportsman can take it instead?

Ones with contacts to universities that have good rugby teams that want to keep them good, almost an academy feeder system.

I never said anyone fixes courses. If you don’t think the pro teams working alongside uni’s (as others have gone on to allude to) have a good amount of sway then you need to wake up.

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