The summer of cricket 2020

First topic message reminder :

We have actual cricket news for the first time in forever...and some hope that we will see some test matches this summer!

England bowlers began a return to individual training on Thursday, with batsmen and wicketkeepers scheduled to make a return on 1st June, in anticipation of the West Indies series being rescheduled to begin on 8th July (all according to various reports).

There was also reports a few weeks back they might play some one day games, whilst tests are happening too. Not seen anything else about that, but with England’s depth in the shorter format it could be done you’d think players wise (and actually would present a good opportunity to some on the fringes)

ECB is going to confirm the full list of players who will resume training next week. Murmurings about Hales in the one day stuff don’t go away...

So anyways - let’s keep fingers crossed, and hope everyone who posts here is healthy and staying safe too

Jennings saw off the pace men but loses his wicket to Bess of all people.

Jennings goes to Bess in his second over. Very early in his spell obviously but Bess already looks like he's in better rhythm than Leach or Mo did yesterday. Makes sense given he's played more red ball cricket in the last year.

Zak Crawley playing some lovely drives here - 33 not out and going along nicely after lunch.

In a shocking turn of events, Bairstow is out driving.

Yeah looks like the Foakes bandwagon is rolling right over Bairstow.

Crawley Wood and Bess sticking their hands up well by the looks of things.

Crawley is doing himself plenty of favours here. I really hope he gets the number 3 spot. Particularly with Root unavailable for the first Test. We need a fluent batsman in that top 4.

Bairstow on the other hand not doing himself favours. If he got runs in this match I reckon Jonny might have batted at 4 in Root's place. The selectors really like having him in the side and he adds some experience in Root's absence.

Burns
Sibley
Crawley
Lawrence
Stokes
Pope

Would be my top six, that top four is severely lacking in experience but it's for one match, could possibly have Lawrence at six with Stokes and Pope moving up one spot.

Stokes has decided he doesn't rate Bess much.

Crawley goes to a jaffa from Woakes just after we start bigging him up...

Ben Foakes is a rubbish batsman. He never hits sixes or makes centuries of 48 deliveries.

alfie wrote:

And why on earth could they not put Woakes in the same team with Stokes and Foakes to give Olly peace at last !

Woakes currently bowling to Foakes and Stokes. I am at peace

Ball of the two days that from Woakes, Crawley did well to edge it behind.

Soul Requiem wrote:Burns
Sibley
Crawley
Lawrence
Stokes
Pope

Would be my top six, that top four is severely lacking in experience but it's for one match, could possibly have Lawrence at six with Stokes and Pope moving up one spot.

Stokes has decided he doesn't rate Bess much.

I'd agree with that, Soul. I have a feeling the selectors might want some more experience instead of Lawrence though so perhaps Denly or Bairstow. I've said it a few times but I think Northeast would fit 3 or 4 in this England order well.

I won't bring up he who must not be named from the Taunton dust bowl as I don't want to risk some peoples health.

I really want to see Stokes and Pope stay at 5 and 6. I think it gives our lower middle order a really strong back bone as well as two batsman who can take the game away from teams with their stroke play. Add Root at 4, one of the talented keepers at 7 hopefully scoring runs and Moeen/Woakes/Curran/Bess at 8. Suddenly we have a strong backbone running through the middle and lower middle order. Just need the top 3 to settle now...

Stokes is seeing it like a beach ball out there. Good signs that one of England's most important players is in form.

Soul Requiem wrote:Burns
Sibley
Crawley
Lawrence
Stokes
Pope

Would be my top six, that top four is severely lacking in experience but it's for one match, could possibly have Lawrence at six with Stokes and Pope moving up one spot.

Stokes has decided he doesn't rate Bess much.

I would agree with this top six, albeit wouldn't be moving Stokes/Pope for the sake of one match.

I'd imagine the selectors will probably go Denly over Lawrence to add a bit more experience into the top four though.

Real selection issue is how on earth are you going to pick only three seamers from Anderson, Broad, Archer, Wood and Woakes!

king_carlos wrote:Stokes is seeing it like a beach ball out there. Good signs that one of England's most important players is in form.

...Trebell...is that you?

It's going to be Anderson, Broad and Archer for the first test that's for sure.

Experience has to be the most over rated aspect of the game, i'm not too sure what the top three is going to gain from having Denly or Bairstow at four when you know one of them will has a ceiling of about 35 and the other will either be caught behind or bowled attempting an extravagant drive. I agree it's the way the selectors will go but seems counterproductive to me considering it's a free hit for Lawrence so to speak knowing that he'll be in for one match before Root returns so nothing to lose at all but a lot to gain.

king_carlos wrote:Crawley goes to a jaffa from Woakes just after we start bigging him up...

Ben Foakes is a rubbish batsman. He never hits sixes or makes centuries of 48 deliveries.

Hi Carlos - I read earlier today that Everton Weekes hit only two sixes in his entire Test career - and one of them was all run!

Looks like it's another ''thanks for turning up'' badge for poor Lewis Gregory. A tidy but wicketless 7 overs yesterday and a 4 ball duck today. A decade ago he was captaining England under 19s and seemingly set for a full international career.

Virdi replaces the unwell Sam Curran and snaffles the final wicket after 5 very tidy overs.

Id argue forms more overated than experience when you're basing it on one innings of a 3 day knockabout.

Gooseberry wrote:Id argue forms more overated than experience when you're basing it on one innings of a 3 day knockabout.

Who's basing it on one innings? It's more to do with his recent form for both the Lions and Essex.

guildfordbat wrote:Looks like it's another ''thanks for turning up'' badge for poor Lewis Gregory. A tidy but wicketless 7 overs yesterday and a 4 ball duck today. A decade ago he was captaining England under 19s and seemingly set for a full international career.

Yeah struggling to see a route for him to make the red ball side anytime soon - but can certainly make an impact in the ODI/T20 squads I think, did alright in his limited opportunities last winter there

Ollie Robinson is a very, very good bowler. He’ll do well to get a go this summer with Broad/Anderson/Jof/Wood/Woakes all ahead of him as pure bowlers, but looked good yesterday and has an exceptional FC record. Plus he can hold a bat which always helps. Hope they look at him if they rotate a bit.

Bowling queue looks fairly long at present :

Apart from the list JD supplied we have two Currans , Mahmood , Stone (when he's fit) , two Overtons , and I'm probably still forgetting someone ...

The split for this practice match was interesting. Anderson was really the only first choice bowler on the Stokes team (apart from Ben of course) while all the other leading seam candidates lined up with the other side. Which arguably gave the Stokes team batters a more testing workout. Not sure how much the scores in this match will actually feed into first match selection...to be honest I suspect the incumbents will largely continue for now regardless of what has been done in this game ; but it has still probably served a useful purpose in giving some competition and a bit of a look at some fringe players.

JDizzle wrote:Ollie Robinson is a very, very good bowler. He’ll do well to get a go this summer with Broad/Anderson/Jof/Wood/Woakes all ahead of him as pure bowlers, but looked good yesterday and has an exceptional FC record. Plus he can hold a bat which always helps. Hope they look at him if they rotate a bit.

Reminds me of Bresnan, doens't look like much when he's bustling in but generates decent pace and shape.

On a different note, it doesn't appear that the cricketers are not all married to hairdressers like the footballers, lots of players with longer hair than normal.

alfie wrote:Bowling queue looks fairly long at present :

Apart from the list JD supplied we have two Currans , Mahmood , Stone (when he's fit) , two Overtons , and I'm probably still forgetting someone ...

The split for this practice match was interesting. Anderson was really the only first choice bowler on the Stokes team (apart from Ben of course) while all the other leading seam candidates lined up with the other side. Which arguably gave the Stokes team batters a more testing workout.  Not sure how much the scores in this match will actually feed into first match selection...to be honest I suspect the incumbents will largely continue for now regardless of what has been done in this game ; but it has still probably served a useful purpose in giving some competition and a bit of a look at some fringe players.

Largely in agreement regarding the selections for tests. England will have had a core team inked in regardless of this, but there are a few spots I do believe are wide open for this game and practise to decide. A couple of players have noted that there's a real air of healthy competition and intensity around the camp as a result of the unusual circumstances and rotation opportunities.

Number 3 is definitely an open question. I think Sinley Burns was pretty much a given but Denly Crawley is an open choice, Crawley only has a cap by accident.

So.ilar for spinners. Bess has had a couple of bites a test cricket thanks to there being no-one else left to pick, but did deliver one magic innings for England " and can hold a bat which never hurts". Leach is in theory the best spinner England have and would've been the man in (twice) had it not been for his misfortunes. Mo is mo and everyone wants to find a place for the version of him that works. I think we can discount Vidri and Crane but so far this match has put Bess as the man.

Pace wise there's a straight shoot out between Archer and Wood to decide, although there's been indications that England might go for two out and out pacemen over Broad if conditions suit it. All four of the senior picks and Stokes are going to miss at least on eyes each, and with Curran ill theres ame opportunity

Also Root missing the first test leaves another batting spot open.

Wicket keeper wise I think they will stick with Buttler bust fosters not hurt his case at all, and again will get a test on rotation at some point this summer.

Might be reading too much into this, but might not be the greatest sign for Lawrence’s chances that Denly, Pope and Buttler are all in ahead of him. Albeit he did get a good dig in the first innings whereas Pope and Buttler didn’t really have much time too, so might just be wanting to give them time in the middle...

And now Woakes is getting a hit ahead of Lawrence so you may be right , Olly.

I was just thinking : the more I saw of Moeen and Leach bowling since lunch the surer I was Bess will be in the team...then I look away for a minute and see Buttler has somehow got out to Mo .  Not sure how,  he was bowling some right old rubbish ? Two wickets now though. Still wouldn't fancy picking him at the moment , he looks way too loose to me...

TBF Mo gets a lot of his wickets by bowling "tempting lengths" and asking people to hit him.
Going more than 6 an over though, he needs more than two wickets to prove hes ready to jump back in to tests skill wise or mentally.

In terms of Lawrence he was always a bit of a rank outsider lets be honest. Theres a sizeable chunk of players here to make up the numbers and with an eye to the long term future. Denly might wish that Lawrence had been in ahead of him though, Crawleys stock like Bess' is rising as much to do with others struggles as their own performances.

In an ideal world Crawley wouldn't be near the team at the moment, he's got a lot of potential but is far from the finished article but he does seem to possess a decent temperent and does have a good range of shots so is less likely to get bogged down than most of the top order guys that have been tried recently. What he does need is constant cricket in order to improve and thankfully he doesn't play a lot of limited overs rubbish.

alfie wrote:And now Woakes is getting a hit ahead of Lawrence so you may be right , Olly.

I was just thinking : the more I saw of Moeen and Leach bowling since lunch the surer I was Bess will be in the team...then I look away for a minute and see Buttler has somehow got out to Mo .  Not sure how,  he was bowling some right old rubbish ? Two wickets now though.  Still wouldn't fancy picking him at the moment , he looks way too loose to me...

Yeah neither spinner on Team Stokes has really done their chances much good in this game - Leach has been all over the shop too.

Bess has been the best spinner on show, he's the only one who's been able to bowl a containing line, Ali and Leach have been taken apart.

Soul Requiem wrote:In an ideal world Crawley wouldn't be near the team at the moment,.......What he does need is constant cricket in order to improve

Perhaps worth noting that the only place hes going to get cricket at the moment is in the team.....

Wondering if the pitch crumbled a bit after day one...spinners cashed in wickets wise. Very odd move to have Bairstow open, suggests England may well be considering to use him as the cover spot for Root.

Mo really should have to wait for a test return.

Suspect this will be the XI barring any injuries

Burns
Sibley
Crawley
Denly
Stokes
Pope
Buttler
Bess
Archer
Broad
Anderson

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Suspect this will be the XI barring any injuries

Burns
Sibley
Crawley
Denly
Stokes
Pope
Buttler
Bess
Archer
Broad
Anderson

Yep, that's my suspicion as well. Maybe Denly batting at 3.

That is probably most likely - though I am not sure Archer automatically comes straight back ahead of Wood ?

Gooseberry wrote:Wondering if the pitch crumbled a bit after day one...spinners cashed in wickets wise. Very odd move to have Bairstow open, suggests England may well be considering to use him as the cover spot for Root.

Mo really should have to wait for a test return.

These second innings choices all suggest giving everyone game time was the chief consideration...the spinners on both sides were given a good run with the quicks used more sparingly , and batsmen who did not have long first innings pushed up the order.
They may think of including Bairstow in order to avoid what could be rather a ponderous top four. But I reckon they are more likely to retain both Crawley (who actually does have a few strokes , even if his quality against a top attack remains yet to be proved) and Denly (consistent if unspectacular) and let the stroke players that follow worry about making up for a possible slow run rate.
Given recent England performances the most likely negative situation is possibly being six down for under eighty at lunch

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/53290755

Bess gets the nod over Leach and Ali. Team likely to be the one Olly put up earlier. Nine reserves listed, just in case the worst happens.

Meanwhile the West Indies look to be in a bit of a state.

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/29401113/west-indies-batting-form-worry-admits-estwick

Which estwick is that?

The Bess selection seems fair enough. Hes not really an attacking threat but has shown he can hold an end in test cricket (although lets be straight SA are genuinely awful against spinners), and whilst Leach and Mo might be better attacking spinners they look as rusty as you'd expect and frankly if England at home with the kind of weather we've had recently are relying on their spinner to get the wickets then they picked the wrong seamers.

Its interesting that they've been so decisive and clear in this selection too, backing their man. Mo not even in the reserves speaks volumes, but quite rightly.

Denly is the guy to replace Root. Quite a trade down, the short term gap filler keeps it up. In theory we shouldn't see Englands top order fold over in 30 overs, but we could be two sessions in by the time they pass a 100!
Not a selection that fills me with enthusiasm, but I can see how its happened with Crawley, Pope, Sibley, Bess and Archer still being very new to test cricket I guess hes there to add that air of calm seasoned professional ( with all 14 of his test cap.....) and maybe be a bit of foil to Stokes' aggressive instinct.

I guess Pope will stay at 6 but really think hes wasted a bit there with Root out. Feels like and ideal time to bump him to at least 5, and maybe take some pressure off Stokes moving him down a bit. I would've liked to have seen him given the 4 spot and Lawrence given a go ahead of Denly. But it is what it is, and despite putting him out to open Bairstows not even in the reserves. Its not a decision that shocks me, just feels flat an lacking ambition.

Another point id like to see some ambition on is the selection of the seamers based on conditions. Both Wood and Archer got solid returns from the warm up, and whilst picking both of them and Anderson and leaving out Broad might be seen as asking for trouble, but if youre picking your spinner because he can hold down an end and youve got Stokes in the side then if the wicket doesnt look like its going to aid Broads medium pace then maybe you could just go with two 90mph bowlers England have spent years wishing they had. Broads just one of those players though who every time hes written off pipes up with a match winning spell.

Have know seen a bit more context to Mo and Bairstow not being named in reserve, it allows them to go to the white ball camp. Makes sense.

Also appears Denly will bat 3 and Crawely at 4 rather oddly.

Gooseberry wrote:Have know seen a bit more context to Mo and Bairstow not being named in reserve, it allows them to go to the white ball camp. Makes sense.

Also appears Denly will bat 3 and Crawely at 4 rather oddly.

Hi goose - that's what I was suggesting last night. Assuming you're not basing things on my post , where do you get Denly at 3 from? Cheers.

guildfordbat wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:Have know seen a bit more context to Mo and Bairstow not being named in reserve, it allows them to go to the white ball camp. Makes sense.

Also appears Denly will bat 3 and Crawely at 4 rather oddly.

Hi goose - that's what I was suggesting last night. Assuming you're not basing things on my post , where do you get Denly at 3 from? Cheers.

Cricinfo interview with Ed Smith

Fairly logical selection decisions all round given the limited lead up. The seam bowling - unusually unhindered by fitness issues , at least for now - is the only real open question. I note Goose's thoughts re Broad v the two out-and-out pace men (Woakes is apparently more or less forgotten in all this ?) but would expect England to go with the two experienced campaigners for this first game...in the further expectation that some rotation options may follow...
Batting will obviously change around when Root returns and first game performances are therefore important. Buttler seems safe for now despite a pretty dismal recent record , as Foakes seems only to be seen as a spare ; but you'd think that will be reconsidered if he continues to turn in the sort of scores he was getting in SA.

Lot of reserves ! Pretty well all those not picked for the Test and not wanted for ODIs... Not so much reserves as net bowlers , then ? Makes some sense to keep them around the squad in the present strange circumstances.

Denly three Crawley four ? Does that put more pressure on the younger man given Root will be back soon ? Not sure it makes a lot of difference , to be honest. The top four actually look more or less interchangeable. And I'd say the same for Pope and Stokes so have no problem with the order as it is.

We can probably wait until the first disaster to start throwing turnips at the selectors

Its not entirely clear from the Smith interview if Denly or Crawley was the extra man, but it does seem they are very impressed by Denlys ability to bat time and aren't overly concerned with runs scored. On performances in an England shirt Crawley fully deserves his place, albeit that most of his runs have come in warm ups rather than tests he's averaged 46 in red ball for England and mostly as an opener.
The real run machine though is Pope, both for England and a county level. Of all the players in the side hes probably the one you'd look to to be getting the centuries, but is likely batting 6.
I have previously felt that Crawley was rushed into the side and not really ready, but as it stands its the right place for him to be and he's done more than could have been expected for a guy with such a modest first class record. Pope I'm in no rush to see moved up as the long term solution to 3 that some have him nailed on as, but to me this was maybe an ideal opportunity to give him a game at 4 where he has the best chance to do what Root doesn't and make a match winning hundred. At 6 hes protected and can play his shots but can quickly run out of partners, you could argue Denly could be very effective down there being allowed freedom to play the aggressive cricket thats made him a (modest) success in white ball.

But Smith has been quite clear they are sticking to what worked in SA, judge players on time at the crease not runs scored and get them playing proper test innings again. Its hard to argue too much with that after such a long period of utter disfunction in the batting.

You'll have a hard time convincing me that Denly is a quality test player and the level required for England to realise their lofty ambitions though. At least Crawley is young enough to get better.

In terms of Woakes he will probably start one or two tests in the series ahead of either Broad or Anderson as part of the rotation. I'm a but of a worker fanboy but being realistic he was never going to be a first name on the team sheet player with everyone fit, and didn't make the best of the chances he was given in the last 18 months.

alfie wrote:That is probably most likely - though I am not sure Archer automatically comes straight back ahead of Wood ?

To be honest, I would expect those two are going to rotate throughout the tests, so not sure it is "one ahead of the other" so to speak.

Also see the usual suggestions about dropping Broad floating about on twitter - while I understood it a few years back, I think it would be incredibly harsh to do so based on how he performed last summer and last winter. He was exceptional against both Australia and in South Africa, even more so when you consider he was the leader of the attack with Anderson injured for the majority of those series (so much so he earned himself a spot on the Sri Lanka tour when he had openly stated he didn't want to tour there!!)

It might be sacrilegious to say, but I think Jimmy needs to be part of a rotation with Woakes/Curran at this point of his career. Clearly the body can't hold up to a full test schedule as it used too, so really pick and choose his venues (especially considering in England at least, Woakes's record with the ball is incredible, so he could, potentially, make an argument for being in the XI on merit for home tests).

Also glad to see they've gone with Bess as the spinner to begin with - he certainly earned it with his performance in South Africa, and as stated both Leach and Ali really did not do their case any good with their performances in the warm up.

With regards to Broad, how many lefties are in the West Indies team? Last summer he was devastating against the left handers but far less so against the right handers, something to consider I would think. If we're dropping Anderson i'd be selecting Wood and going with a duel speed attack.

Soul Requiem wrote:With regards to Broad, how many lefties are in the West Indies team? Last summer he was devastating against the left handers but far less so against the right handers, something to consider I would think. If we're dropping Anderson i'd be selecting Wood and going with a duel speed attack.

A fair point, Soul. Only one I can think of is Shimron Hetmyer. A very dangerous player but not the best red ball record it must be said.

Broad did look in good rhythm during the warm-ups though. I've often felt he's a bowler who finds his feet quick after a break which might stand him in good stead.

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Also glad to see they've gone with Bess as the spinner to begin with - he certainly earned it with his performance in South Africa, and as stated both Leach and Ali really did not do their case any good with their performances in the warm up.

Agree there, Olly. It's hard luck for Leach to have missed so much cricket after gaining his Monty-esque cult status last summer. Neither Leach nor Mo looked in good rhythm though in the warm-ups. To be honest I actually thought Virdi bowled better than both in his brief cameo as a replacement but he's a way down the pecking order currently.

I was really impressed with Bess after his recall. During his initial opportunities he reminded me of the what Terry Jenner often said about young spinners knowing the mechanics of how to bowl spin but not knowing what to bowl yet. When to risk tossing it up above the eye line, when to bowl a bit quicker, look for more turn, look to keep it tight, etc. Bess looked a much more mature bowler in his recall.

guildfordbat wrote:

king_carlos wrote:Crawley goes to a jaffa from Woakes just after we start bigging him up...

Ben Foakes is a rubbish batsman. He never hits sixes or makes centuries of 48 deliveries.

Hi Carlos - I read earlier today that Everton Weekes hit only two sixes in his entire Test career - and one of them was all run!

Hi guildford, sorry for my slow reply but I thought you'd appreciate this! 

My grandfather who was a massive cricket fan, attending every club game he could, an Essex member for many years and incredibly knowledgeable about the game, used to tell us a great story about Weekes that my dad reminded me of after his sad passing.

Weekes was playing league cricket and absolutely dominating the bowlers during a fairly small chase on a picturesque but tiny South Yorkshire ground. A young spinner came on and got the treatment from Weekes for the first three balls. On the fourth delivery the young lad was bold enough to toss it up above the eyeline, almost as if commending his bravery Weekes came down the wicket and missed the ball by a comical (some might even say intentional...) distance. The wicketkeeper and long time captain of his club fumbled the stumping chance and Weekes some what reluctantly grounded his bat behind the crease.

In the clubhouse after the game Weekes asked the keeper what happened, he responded, "I've been playing 20 years and haven't even met Fred Trueman, that lad wasn't getting Everton Weekes out".