Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[Soul Requiem]

First topic message reminder :

The far left is often dependent on where an individual themselves is on the political spectrum, for example Owen Jones may be seen as far left to someone who is centre right but to a centrist will be seen as merely left wing, personally have him down as part of the hard left.

I have him as left wing. Though is hard left not the same as far left because I dont have him as far left. I get tge views based on your own spectrum though. Which is why I hare labour supporters calling Starmer and others right wing.  Left of centre is not right wing.

I would say that hard left is within the standard left wing myself, thinking of someone like Tony Benn being hard left as opposed to Ed Milliband who was soft left, will say however that is possibly closer to far left than it is the centre.

[beninho]

I'm probably not target audience for the ex royals. I dont think I've ever discussed it with anyone in any detail.

I also don't know anyone who has such mental, ridiculous, over the top and frankly embarrassing views laid out on this thread.

Oxygen thief's? Get over yourself.

[super_realist]

Who is the target audience? I haven't seen anybody give them anything other than short shrift.

For someone who voted for Jeremy Corbyn to claim my views are embarrassing is rather ironic.

What have I said that you disagree with? The main point is that if you want to give advice, it's more effective if you follow it yourself, you disagree with that? , and yes they are oxygen thief's, they thrive on public exposure yet, claim they don't want it. Do you disagree they are self unaware and massive hypocrites?

As I said yesterday, I started this to get some traffic on the board, I took two weeks off posting and the board was pretty dead, why don't you try starting a topic for a change if you don't like it? No one is forcing you to reply if you don't want to.

[beninho]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

[super_realist]

S_r, Harry and Meghan have changed your behaviour, and are getting you to spend your time talking about them. It's entirely possible they may change other people's in different ways, especially those who are royalists or fans of them - and there are actually many of those out there.

They haven't changed my behaviour at all, which orifice did you pull that out of? My views on climate change have had no influence from any celebrity let alone those noobs.

[super_realist]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

Well they're trying to influence how people are voting in the US Elections for a start.

[Soul Requiem]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

Surprised, not surprised this needs spelling out for you.

Person A gets his information about climate change from Prince Harry but also happens to be a big fan of Van Morrison so takes onboard his views of the current pandemic, we net positive there?

[pedro]

Which of course nobody has said but rather that people like Harry and Meghan would be better off not saying anything at all.

Does them speaking out change my opinion of things? No
Do I think they'd be better off not saying anything at all? Yes

Hmm, the TV deal is reportedly worth £100M. So, no.

But news just out that rumours of their reality show was in fact fake news. So maybe they've read our board?

[beninho]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

Well they're trying to influence how people are voting in the US Elections for a start.

So are lots of people. It happens in lots of elections. I'm not seeing an issue with it.

[pedro]

Maybe Harry and Meghan have just outsmarted the public. Doing what they want and making millions on it. Surely no one envies William?

[beninho]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

Surprised, not surprised this needs spelling out for you.

Person A gets his information about climate change from Prince Harry but also happens to be a big fan of Van Morrison so takes onboard his views of the current pandemic, we net positive there?

Well if you accept one you have to accept the other. Maybe I'm more of a believer that people have a right to express views. But, you live and die with the consequences of expressing those views.

[super_realist]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

Surprised, not surprised this needs spelling out for you.

Person A gets his information about climate change from Prince Harry but also happens to be a big fan of Van Morrison so takes onboard his views of the current pandemic, we net positive there?

Well if you accept one you have to accept the other.  Maybe I'm more of a believer that people have a right to express views.  But, you live and die with the consequences of expressing those views.

Ha ha, you claim people have a right to express views and then you call them mental and embarrassing because they aren't the same as yours. Almost as hypocritical as Harry and Meghan

[super_realist]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

Well they're trying to influence how people are voting in the US Elections for a start.

So are lots of people. It happens in lots of elections. I'm not seeing an issue with it.

I'm betting they k ow as much about politics as they do about Climate Change, and probably care as much.
Interestingly Harry is coming back here for a bit soon because if he stays in California for much longer he has to start paying taxes.

[JuliusHMarx]

S_r, Harry and Meghan have changed your behaviour, and are getting you to spend your time talking about them. It's entirely possible they may change other people's in different ways, especially those who are royalists or fans of them - and there are actually many of those out there.

They haven't changed my behaviour at all, which orifice did you pull that out of? My views on climate change have had no influence from any celebrity let alone those noobs.

They've got you writing about them a lot on this thread - surely that's a change of behaviour? I didn't mean behaviour on climate change.

[JAS]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

Well they're trying to influence how people are voting in the US Elections for a start.

So are lots of people. It happens in lots of elections. I'm not seeing an issue with it.

I'm betting they k ow as much about politics as they do about Climate Change, and probably care as much.
Interestingly Harry is coming back here for a bit soon because if he stays in California for much longer he has to start paying taxes.

Sounds like they’ve been taking tax advice from the Tangoed commander in chief himself :-p Do you ever wonder whether it’s the celebs themselves who make these choices or their advisers who make their choices for them?

[beninho]

You seem to move the goalposts the moment your previous line of banality fails. It's a thing, it's neither good or bad but does suggest there are bigger issues at play and to be honest they'll be taking on board a false message.

Goalposts not moved. You just ignored the question.

Neither good or bad, thats such a I play with my 2inch man sausage answer. You don't think it could be good that people may get a better understanding of climate change and/or other issues after hearing a celebrity talk about it?

It depends on the celebrity and what they do about it themselves; David Attenborough and the shows he fronts will have a reasonably high carbon footprint but he's talking with knowledge about the situation and is able to get his point across thusly. If you need Prince Harry to tell you about climate change what other information are you getting from elsewhere or is all information good information? We'll ignore the potential damage done elsewhere.

What damage?

Surprised, not surprised this needs spelling out for you.

Person A gets his information about climate change from Prince Harry but also happens to be a big fan of Van Morrison so takes onboard his views of the current pandemic, we net positive there?

Well if you accept one you have to accept the other.  Maybe I'm more of a believer that people have a right to express views.  But, you live and die with the consequences of expressing those views.

Ha ha, you claim people have a right to express views and then you call them mental and embarrassing because they aren't the same as yours. Almost as hypocritical as Harry and Meghan

Not hypocritical at all. I have no issues people expressing views, but you live with people having opinions and making comments on those views.

[super_realist]

You don't seem to, you seem to shout them down if they aren't the same as yours.

[superflyweight]

You don't seem to, you seem to shout them down if they aren't the same as yours.

Your entire persona on this board is based on doing just that.

[super_realist]

You don't seem to, you seem to shout them down if they aren't the same as yours.

You're entire persona on this board is based on doing just that.  

I don't claim to be doing anything else. I'm not pretending to be virtuous and tolerant whilst simultaneously ridiculing people.

It is not my opinion that Harry and Meghan are hypocrites, it's a demonstrable fact. It is not my opinion that the most effective way to get a message across is to live by the example you want to set. That's a fact.

[beninho]

But the argument that sone people including M&H are hypocrites is not disputed by anyone. Yet, that drum gets banged over and over again.

[JuliusHMarx]

So if Shane Lowry said 'overweight people should try to cut down on fatty foods and exercise more to lose weight and become healthier', would that be good advice or not, leaving aside any hypocrisy?

[super_realist]

It would be good advice, however and here's the crucial thing, it loses a massive amount of credibility and impact when that advice is being dished out by an obese hypocrite.

Why do you lot have such a problem with this? If you thought the advice was so great and it didn't matter from whence it came, why don't marketing people agree with you? They don't have fat people advertising sports gear, they don't have fat slobs advertising healthy food, they don't have Trump advertising HMRC. The message is only part of the story and the greatest impact comes when the message comes from people who A) know what they're talking about and B) actuary follow their own advice.

The value of the message is denuded by the hypocrisy of the person giving the message. The British public may be stupid, but it's not that stupid.

[JuliusHMarx]

It loses credibility because people can't separate the message from the messenger - which is a failure of the people receiving the message. Human nature perhaps, but still a failure. Marketing people recognise this failing and take it into account.

[superflyweight]

Depends on the message and how it is being conveyed. Someone on their death bed dying from lung cancer because they smoked all their life telling you not to smoke is more likely to have an impact than someone like Joe Wicks telling you not to smoke so you can manage a few pull-ups.

Likewise Shane Lowry saying don't eat cake for breakfast or your @rse might burst out of your favourite shorts when you step out of the car might be seen as someone speaking from experience.

[McLaren]

Super

I am not sure you get how advertising works. People don't literally get told what to buy or what to think. An advert might aim to evoke a feeling or get a conversation going rather than be as blunt as to say buy our product. Harry and Meghan talking about climate change only has to make the topic feel relevant among people who wouldn't normally consider it for their message to be a success. And when you consider it will never be their message alone that convinces someone, they only have to make small dents in the way someone views climate change.

[beninho]

I'm unsure who is more stupid, trump or trump supporters.

[JAS]

It would be good advice, however and here's the crucial thing, it loses a massive amount of credibility and impact when that advice is being dished out by an obese hypocrite.

Why do you lot have such a problem with this? If you thought the advice was so great and it didn't matter from whence it came, why don't marketing people agree with you? They don't have fat people advertising sports gear, they don't have fat slobs advertising healthy food, they don't have Trump advertising HMRC. The message is only part of the story and the greatest impact comes when the message comes from people who A) know what they're talking about and B) actuary follow their own advice.

The value of the message is denuded by the hypocrisy of the person giving the message. The British public may be stupid, but it's not that stupid.

Pretty much a wide ranging and comprehensive condemnation of Boris then?

[JAS]

I'm unsure who is more stupid, trump or trump supporters.

Aye and you can add to that....Democrat thinking about the best way to get rid of him. “Yeah, let’s go with a senile old Wall Street suck up”.

The Americans have no choice they HAVE to vote for Biden but Jesus H Christ, it’s going to be close and ugly.

[beninho]

Whoever thought that this country would make it illegal to sing in a pub.

[Soul Requiem]

I don't think i'd be able to bring myself to vote for Biden he's that bad, the fact he's better than Trump shouldn't be the only criteria for voting for someone but alas it is.

[JAS]

I don't think i'd be able to bring myself to vote for Biden he's that bad, the fact he's better than Trump shouldn't be the only criteria for voting for someone but alas it is.

Pretty much the same as last time round, I.e. evil or lesser evil, only last time there was still an element of uncertainty about how bad he could be...this time round there’s no such element of doubt.

The Democrats really really need to wake up

[Soul Requiem]

I don't think i'd be able to bring myself to vote for Biden he's that bad, the fact he's better than Trump shouldn't be the only criteria for voting for someone but alas it is.

Pretty much the same as last time round, I.e. evil or lesser evil, only last time there was still an element of uncertainty about how bad he could be...this time round there’s no such element of doubt.

The Democrats really really need to wake up

From the little I saw; Pete Buttigieg quite impressed me but for obvious reasons in America (ridiculous in the 21st century) he wasn't really backed to the extent he should have been.

[superflyweight]

Difficult one for the Democrats - they do have a bit of an identity crisis at the moment and they need someone to reinvigorate the party, but to beat an incumbent president (even when the incumbent is an idiot sh1tehawk like Trump) their safest bet is to convince middle America that the candidate can be trusted not to be too radical (by their conservatiove standards).

Biden isn't an exciting option - but to middle America he's not dangerous and that might just be enough to win.

[navyblueshorts]

I'm unsure who is more stupid, trump or trump supporters.

Aye and you can add to that....Democrat thinking about the best way to get rid of him. “Yeah, let’s go with a senile old Wall Street suck up”.  

The Americans have no choice they HAVE to vote for Biden but Jesus H Christ, it’s going to be close and ugly.

Good grief! Even you've bought the Trump line on his alleged senility. Just shows why this won't be a shoe-in for Biden.

[McLaren]

I'm unsure who is more stupid, trump or trump supporters.

Aye and you can add to that....Democrat thinking about the best way to get rid of him. “Yeah, let’s go with a senile old Wall Street suck up”.  

The Americans have no choice they HAVE to vote for Biden but Jesus H Christ, it’s going to be close and ugly.

Good grief! Even you've bought the Trump line on his alleged senility. Just shows why this won't be a shoe-in for Biden.

Wall street suck up? might as well just say it Jas. He is "New world Order".

[JAS]

I'm unsure who is more stupid, trump or trump supporters.

Aye and you can add to that....Democrat thinking about the best way to get rid of him. “Yeah, let’s go with a senile old Wall Street suck up”.  

The Americans have no choice they HAVE to vote for Biden but Jesus H Christ, it’s going to be close and ugly.

Good grief! Even you've bought the Trump line on his alleged senility. Just shows why this won't be a shoe-in for Biden.

Wall street suck up? might as well just say it Jas. He is "New world Order".

Neoliberal, like the Clintons, Blair’s, Obama’s yes he most certainly is. Everything that allows the Alt Right to wade in with the claims of hypocrisy and “drain the swamp” type nonsense.

Personally I’d have wanted Sanders but then I wouldn’t. Despite all the Poopie staring them in the face the Yanks are still a million miles away from accepting any tilt toward Socialism. Besides Bernie ain’t no spring chicken either.

Regarding “senile old” Navy, just because Trump says it doesn’t mean there isn’t an element of truth in it. Even a broken clock is right twice a day. The Democrats had a huge field to choose from as well as lessons learnt from 2016 and quite frankly their choice of candidate smacks of uninspired, one more heave fear. I also, like Soul think Buttingieg should have been better supported.

[Soul Requiem]

Neoliberal, like the Clintons, Blair’s, Obama’s yes he most certainly is. Everything that allows the Alt Right to wade in with the claims of hypocrisy and “drain the swamp” type nonsense.

Personally I’d have wanted Sanders but then I wouldn’t. Despite all the Poopie staring them in the face the Yanks are still a million miles away from accepting any tilt toward Socialism. Besides Bernie ain’t no spring chicken either.

Regarding “senile old” Navy, just because Trump says it doesn’t mean there isn’t an element of truth in it. Even a broken clock is right twice a day. The Democrats had a huge field to choose from as well as lessons learnt from 2016 and quite frankly their choice of candidate smacks of uninspired, one more heave fear. I also, like Soul think Buttingieg should have been better supported.

With regard to Obama i've long held the view that he flattered to deceive during his presidency, he said the right things and spoke with eloquence while doing it but I was always left waiting for him to actually implement real change which he didn't. He by and large stuck with the status quo even something like Obamacare was presented as being more 'revolutionary' than it actually was, his reputation is helped by being sandwiched by a pair of imbeciles.

[pedro]

The US election is a bit of a freak show. The VP candidates seem looney as well. At least we’ve got front row tickets.

[super_realist]

I wonder whether all those lefties who were so keen on seeing Cummings be sacked or resign will do the same for rule breaking Corbyn. I doubt it.

[super_realist]

It loses credibility because people can't separate the message from the messenger - which is a failure of the people receiving the message. Human nature perhaps, but still a failure. Marketing people recognise this failing and take it into account.

If you're the sort of person who requires a celebrity to change your opinion on something then it's incredibly stupid to use a celebrity who doesn't follow their own advice isn't it to be a message figurehead isn't it?
Therefore what will the stupid person do when the message is confused? Do they follow the advice they give or do they follow the behaviour of the celebrity.?

[super_realist]

Whoever thought that this country would make it illegal to sing in a pub.

I think Sturgeon started that. What I don't get about this whioe debacle with lockdown is how Sturgeon smells of roses from this but Johnson smells of merde when their decisions have been virtually identical. Both have been absolutely hopeless.

[beninho]

I wonder whether all those lefties who were so keen on seeing Cummings be sacked or resign will do the same for rule breaking Corbyn. I doubt it.

Alternatively, will all those righties who defended Cummings to the hilt or saw no issues be fine with Corbyn?

[super_realist]

I wonder whether all those lefties who were so keen on seeing Cummings be sacked or resign will do the same for rule breaking Corbyn. I doubt it.

Alternatively, will all those righties who defended Cummings to the hilt or saw no issues be fine with Corbyn?

Quite, although to be fair most people condemned Cummings, right or left.

[Soul Requiem]

I wonder whether all those lefties who were so keen on seeing Cummings be sacked or resign will do the same for rule breaking Corbyn. I doubt it.

Alternatively, will all those righties who defended Cummings to the hilt or saw no issues be fine with Corbyn?

I don't like Corbyn so no.

[JAS]

Whoever thought that this country would make it illegal to sing in a pub.

I think Sturgeon started that. What I don't get about this whioe debacle with lockdown is how Sturgeon smells of roses from this but Johnson smells of merde when their decisions have been virtually identical. Both have been absolutely hopeless.

I think it’s a lot (not all) to do with her sticking with the daily pressers. Communication in strange times is tremendously important.

Might not be your type of humour but go to youtube and search “Janey Godley Nicola Sturgeon voiceover” there’s a few of them and mostly hilarious

[super_realist]

Whoever thought that this country would make it illegal to sing in a pub.

I think Sturgeon started that. What I don't get about this whioe debacle with lockdown is how Sturgeon smells of roses from this but Johnson smells of merde when their decisions have been virtually identical. Both have been absolutely hopeless.

I think it’s a lot (not all) to do with her sticking with the daily pressers. Communication in strange times is tremendously important.

Might not be your type of humour but go to youtube and search “Janey Godley Nicola Sturgeon voiceover” there’s a few of them and mostly hilarious

It's bad enough listening to Sturgeon's hideous voice without one that is even more frightful.

As for it being the daily press reports, I think that's a load of rubbish. They've both been getting criticism or no criticism depending on which one it is since day one.

[JAS]

Whoever thought that this country would make it illegal to sing in a pub.

I think Sturgeon started that. What I don't get about this whioe debacle with lockdown is how Sturgeon smells of roses from this but Johnson smells of merde when their decisions have been virtually identical. Both have been absolutely hopeless.

I think it’s a lot (not all) to do with her sticking with the daily pressers. Communication in strange times is tremendously important.

Might not be your type of humour but go to youtube and search “Janey Godley Nicola Sturgeon voiceover” there’s a few of them and mostly hilarious

It's bad enough listening to Sturgeon's hideous voice without one that is even more frightful.

As for it being the daily press reports, I think that's a load of rubbish. They've both been getting criticism or no criticism depending on which one it is since day one.

Serious question...do you struggle with working class Scottishness, particularly West of Scotland accents and find them chavvy and cringeworthy?

I really do think that communication and being open  is the main difference between the perception of Sturgeon and the perception of Johnson. I’d also say like her or loathe her she’s a fairly smart political operator. Johnson must have some of that or he wouldn’t be where he is but he just projects the image of a bumbling bull in a china shop.

[super_realist]

I just find the Glasgow accent hard to listen to, it's aggressive  and harsh, just as I don't like the Brummie accent because it makes the speaker sound simple , Dundee accent because it sounds horrible in every way (if you've never heard a Dundee accent, Google Liz McColgan) Northern Irish accent for similar reasons (Ian Paisley, Gerry Adams Arlene Foster) , Scouse accent, Cockney accent etc
They aren't pleasant to listen to at all.

[super_realist]

If you define "smart political operator" as scheming, manipulative and using a crisis to score political points then yes, she is.

[JAS]

I just find the Glasgow accent hard to listen to, it's aggressive  and harsh, just as I don't like the Brummie accent because it makes the speaker sound simple , Dundee accent because it sounds horrible in every way (if you've never heard a Dundee accent, Google Liz McColgan) Northern Irish accent for similar reasons (Ian Paisley, Gerry Adams Arlene Foster) , Scouse accent, Cockney accent etc
They aren't pleasant to listen to at all.

With doing an annual trip to Carnoustie I’m fairly familiar with a Dundee accent yes. I struggle with Brummie accents and scouse can grate my gears at times. Speaking of Scouse do you have any predictions for Gerrard Currant Buns tonight. I think they’re due a setback/wake up. Hope for Scottish footballs sake they get a result tonight but I can see it going either way.

[JAS]

If you define "smart political operator" as scheming, manipulative and using a crisis to score political points then yes, she is.

Yep scheming and manipulating is EXACTLY what a smart political operator does

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