Welsh Team To Face South Africa (Assuming all are fit and well).

First topic message reminder :

Three weeks out, however things are begining to crystallise for September 11th. This is my team to face the Boks.

15 Halfpenny

14 North
13 Roberts
12 Hook
11 Williams

10 Jones
9 Phillips

1. James
2 Bennett
3 Jones

4. Wyn Jones
5 Davies

6 Lydiate
7 Warburton
8 Jones

Bench:
Mitchell, Burns, Faletau, Powell, Knoyle, Davies, Williams.

Reasoning:

1. Gethin- forget it at moment.
2. Bennett - best of bad bunch, but good in both England tests.
3. Faletau - need Ryan in the big one, Toby's time will come.
4. Jones/Hook - help me out here. I just think Roberts and Davies aint working. We need Hooks flair but the question is whether Jones is going to be up for this first game. All thoughts welcome.
5. Byrne, no form to merit being in the squad nevermind the team.


What do people think?

RubyGuby wrote:Then stop being so quick to "bite" all the time. If I'm honest I would give anything to have the nastiest 8 forwards in the game. I grew up in the 70's with the Ponty front row and some real head bangers in the side. We now have the nicest forwards going and it gets us nowhere. I'm not condoning violence but there is little room for angels in the loose and more often than not its the retaliation that gets picked up. Take a ChileRalapele pill and stop biting so quickly.

Mate there are a few things in life that regardless of the reason gets our backs up.

Mine are:
The incessant ramblings of an idiot - can't stand debating with stupid people.
The incessant remarks about South African players being thugs we also play rugby, and all countries have thugs.
Dishonest people - lower than sub zero
Arrogant people - judgemental ignorant plonkers
Disrespectful people - needed a few more hidings in their lives.

So those are the things I instantly respond to, tough job, but someone has to do it.

Bilton - oyu are funy mate and a true Saffer looking at thos traits - Nobody by the way needs a few more hidings to learn respect but there you go.

biltongbek wrote:No worries.

I guess there are just people that loves to lable a person as a thug and then completely forget that the person involved is also a rugby player.

Fact is you can't excuse any foul play, for for goodness sake, there are surely more important things to discuss than something a player did many moons ago.

BB...you are biting mate, just ignore the WUM about SA....they aren't a dirty side per se but have had some dirty players as have all rugby teams. The reason people keep banging on about it is because Saffas always seem to bite down hard when it is brought up

Gatts you are right. I shouldn't react.

I suppose I respond in a different manner.

When people say we are thugs, I can quote PDv "this is not ballet"

when people say we don't play rugby, I can say "you better hope we don't start playing rugby any time soon"

But alas, I am just a simple minded Boer, who gets his blood pressure rising when people have nothing to bring to a conversation except "boring, thug, duh"

The thing is Bilton - when you react like that on here people are going to think you're a thug - Enjoy the rugby, enjoy the passion but never lose a sense of perspective

I might av a chat to you on Monday depending

RubyGuby wrote:The thing is Bilton - when you react like that on here people are going to think you're a thug - Enjoy the rugby, enjoy the passion but never lose a sense of perspective

I might av a chat to you on Monday depending

RubyGuby, I think I have proven to those that matter on 606v2 that I am much more than just a mere thug. I am prepared to debate any point with civility and intellect, however I am hard headed and very passionate and don't have time for petty nonsense.

Bilton relax buddy I see you in a straight jacket before kick off Sunday

Nah, mate, I am calm and relaxed, perhaps I like the blood rushing a bit before the anticipated kick off.

But do not fear, after every session on 606v2 I have an appointment with my therapist, we discuss matters, I cry on her shoulder, she reminds me that it is only a game, I get angry because she thinks that, and sends me on my way with medication.

biltongbek wrote:Nah, mate, I am calm and relaxed, perhaps I like the blood rushing a bit before the anticipated kick off.

But do not fear, after every session on 606v2 I have an appointment with my therapist, we discuss matters, I cry on her shoulder, she reminds me that it is only a game, I get angry because she thinks that, and sends me on my way with medication.

Reckon you are tense cos you know we are going to stuff you boys!!

There is that very, very, small, minute, distinctly improbable possibility.

But yet, a greater most likely, favourable and possible outcome for the Springboks victory.

assuming you boys don't all get binned for being dirty

Well as long as we don't have more than 5 send offs we'll be OK.

You need to have a chat with the RugbyShrink Bilton

RubyGuby wrote:You need to have a chat with the RugbyShrink Bilton

Are you talking about the rugbyshrink on old 606?

In that case he did declare me sane, and fully cognitave.

Although that was quite a while ago.

biltongbek wrote:Well as long as we don't have more than 5 send offs we'll be OK.

good lad...no biteage whatsoever....if you can learn so quick maybe the boks can learn to play clean rugby

Gatts, I do know the difference between humor and WUM.

Those that knows me well on here, know how to use humor to get a point across, those that don't still needs to learn.

So you're only tipping a 10 point margin biltong... that makes my 23 look silly!

biltongbek wrote:Gatts, I do know the difference between humor and WUM.

Those that knows me well on here, know how to use humor to get a point across, those that don't still needs to learn.

ha ha you take yourself a bit seriously don't you...get a grip man!!

Are you sure he didn't declare you fully CogNative

We'll have no re-cognishion of this thread come Monday I bet.

Linebreaker wrote:So you're only tipping a 10 point margin biltong... that makes my 23 look silly!

Did you see my prediction?

I have a secret formula that I am using, if it works I'll let you know. I have 4 factors that influences my prediction, quite interested to see how accurate it is.


Gatts, on the contrary, I am not a serious man

biltongbek wrote:

Linebreaker wrote:So you're only tipping a 10 point margin biltong... that makes my 23 look silly!

Did you see my prediction?

I have a secret formula that I am using, if it works I'll let you know. I have 4 factors that influences my prediction, quite interested to see how accurate it is.


Gatts, on the contrary, I am not a serious man

Yeah, I've just checked the picks from everyone who's done them so far. We have the exact same margin for Fiji-Namibia.

I've been a little bolder with the most of the others compared to you...

+16 for NZ-Tonga
+22 for Scot-Romania
+9 for France-Japan
can't see your Eng-Arg but I said Eng by 15
+7 for Aus-Italy
-4 for Ire-USA
+13 for SA-Wales

So what's your secret formula, mate?

I am not at my office now, but I will PM it to you tomorrow, you must just not share it with anyone else, otherwise we will all make the same predictions.

Agreed?

OK. I have a 'special formula' too... of sorts.

I just look at overall average scores, recent scores, then sort of guess the likely score based on latest form. Not really a good method because I also have a 'gut feeling' factor which can be + or - 20 points... depending on how I feel at any given moment.

I fear I've gone way overboard with my first one - NZ-Tonga, however I just feel the Islanders will be overwhelmed. Did you see someone tipped Tonga by 29? I sure hope they're wrong!

If I remember it was Taffin. Probably meant to say NZ by 29

My formula is a lot easier, you'll see. Not guaranteed to work but will see after this weekend

Fly-half Stephen Jones is almost certain to lose his fitness race to face South Africa in their opening World Cup game on Sunday.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/14774382.stm

I can't say I am disappointed as he is currently third choice and has a poor record over the last 2 years. I would rather we took Tovey for the experience for 4 years time, also covers FB.

15 Halfpenny

14 North
13 Roberts
12 Hook
11 Williams

10 Jones
9 Phillips

1. James
2 Bennett
3 Adam

4. Brad
5 Alun-wyn

6 Lydiate
7 Warburton
8 Ryan (Powell if Ryan is injured)

Bench:
Mitchell, Burns, Charteris, Powell (Faletau if Ryan injured), Knoyle, Halfpenny, Williams.

Dominic:

S Jones is fortunately almost certainly ruled out.

biltongbek wrote:If I remember it was Taffin. Probably meant to say NZ by 29

My formula is a lot easier, you'll see. Not guaranteed to work but will see after this weekend

Guilty as charged!A senior moment/c*ck-up occured as I got the teams the wrong way around.Not my cleverest moment,thus far..
Biltong,I am seriously beginning to doubt your ethnicity as you come across as a nice fella.Why do all other SA posters on all sites come across as knuckle-scraping braggarts?

Taffin, unfortunately some of them are.

glamorganalun wrote:Dominic:

S Jones is fortunately almost certainly ruled out.

Ah yes forgot to change the backs!

15 - Priestland
14 - North
13 - Jon davies
12 - Jaw
11 - Shane
10 - Hook
9 - Phillips

Byrne, North,Davies, Roberts, Williams, Hook, Phillips, James, Bennett, Jones, Davies, Wyn Jones, Lydiate, Warburton, Jones. Bench Mitchell, Burns, Charteris, Faletau, Knoyle, Priestland, Williams.
That would be my team and the only position I was dubious about was Williams or Halfpenny on the bench.

15. Preistland
14. North
13. Davies
12. Roberts
11. Williams
10. Hook
9. Phillips

8. Jones
7. Warburton
6. Lydiate
5. Jones
4. Davies
3. Jones
2. Bennett
1. James

16. Bevington
17. Owens
18. Charteris
19. Faletau
20. Knoyle
21. Williams
22. Halfpenny

I would be happy with that selection.

Seriously,never mind the selection.It is now time for the coaches to earn their corn.We have gradually chipped away at SA and are now genuinely in contention IF the coach gets the player's heads in the right place.The players must believe that they can win and the youngsters like Lydiate and Warburton and North have not got too much garbage in this regard.This is why I would also start with Toby at 8.
WG must make our boys feel 10 ft tall as they take on the Bokke.

I'd start with Toby. Let's back ourselves.

But I don't see Gatland starting with him.

luckless_pedestrian wrote:I'd start with Toby. Let's back ourselves.

But I don't see Gatland starting with him.

I agree, he is a bolter to be sure but this isn't the right start for him. We will miss his carrying but we need Ryan's experience to counter Bok back row

Gatts wrote:

luckless_pedestrian wrote:I'd start with Toby. Let's back ourselves.

But I don't see Gatland starting with him.

I agree, he is a bolter to be sure but this isn't the right start for him. We will miss his carrying but we need Ryan's experience to counter Bok back row

Ryan's experience is to have repeatedly lost to SA.Toby has never experienced that.Toby must start.

Based on that thought process don't pick anyone who has lost to SA?!

I understand what you are saying and were Toby a few games more experienced than he is I would start him without a thought...that we are even debating this after 3 games indicates his class. He is the future no doubt but for me Ryan is the solid option, he brings more to the back row, leadership in a side without SJ, MW, GJ and what we need is experience of high pressure rugby.

Toby f lydiate and warbs is a v young back row to start a world cup game.

I'd be happy with one of them on the bench, bring on toby f with 20 minutes to go (push ryan upto second row)

Gat's will go with Sideways Jones at 8. He'll be his usual dreadful self in attack. I'd pick Toby myself, but he just hasn't been given the game time.
We have no set piece against the maters of the set piece.
People bang on about our back-line, but will they see any ball?
We may be fit, but there's a lot of dross going out on that field on sunday.
Bennett hooking. Best of a bad bunch and possibly wouldn't be first choice for a lot of other top nations.
Bradley Jones and AWJ. Please step up.
Ryan Jones. One word. Donkey.
Phillips. No form. Doesn't suit our style.
Centres. Can they play together.
Full back. Byrne i expect. Oh dear.

We could have the Aussie back-line, but if you can't win any ball, you're stumped.

Samoa will be the test. I heard Shane Williams banging on that we'd run SA close in our last 2 games. 2 games in which we were at home and in 1 game SA were drastically weakened. Playing them on neutral ground will be very different. As for the Samoa game. It'll feel like an away game and I can see our super fit team not having a clue how to beat them. CIAO

Gats.

It's Warren Gatland's own fault that Faletau hasn't been given the game time. With Grampa Stephen Jones again crocked, it also shows that he should have given Priestland more than 20 minutes in the 6N's. I personally don't think Phillips suits our style, but behind him, there is no experience in Knoyljavascript:emoticonp('')e and Williams. If Phillips had a knock and had to pull out, we'd have 2 international novices. Great preparation! I shouldn't criticise. He's only had 4 years!
The friendlies smacked of desperation and although we beat an England team who massacred our set-piece and beat an Argentinian team who were playing their first international game for half a year. You'd be very foolish to believe that when we play a competitive game, we'll get away with the huge flaws we have.

manofgwent wrote:Gat's will go with Sideways Jones at 8. He'll be his usual dreadful self in attack. I'd pick Toby myself, but he just hasn't been given the game time.
We have no set piece against the maters of the set piece.
People bang on about our back-line, but will they see any ball?
We may be fit, but there's a lot of dross going out on that field on sunday.
Bennett hooking. Best of a bad bunch and possibly wouldn't be first choice for a lot of other top nations.
Bradley Jones and AWJ. Please step up.
Ryan Jones. One word. Donkey.
Phillips. No form. Doesn't suit our style.
Centres. Can they play together.
Full back. Byrne i expect. Oh dear.

We could have the Aussie back-line, but if you can't win any ball, you're stumped.

Samoa will be the test. I heard Shane Williams banging on that we'd run SA close in our last 2 games. 2 games in which we were at home and in 1 game SA were drastically weakened. Playing them on neutral ground will be very different. As for the Samoa game. It'll feel like an away game and I can see our super fit team not having a clue how to beat them. CIAO

I agree on all of this; but until the last game we were in with a look in to win the 6Ns and i suppose WG wasn't prepared to experiment...if Faletau had had more time this year he would be a shoe in now, if Henson wasn't injured, if Rees and geth were fit.

Wales always have an 'if' factor

If this were our pack

GETH
REES
JONES
AWJ
BD
SW
TF
DL

I would be expecting a victory.

Hibberd is a loss let alone rees. Bennet 3rd choice but all he needs to do is hit his jumper, i would settle for that

BD and AWJ really need to step up...thought AWJ had a cracking game in one of the warm ups but he has never really been consistent. If they can produce what they are capable of behind AJ we can get parity at set piece. Our back row is class, SW world class.
Yes RJ is a donkey but he will bring experience and leadership in a pack that is hugely talented but

We are fitter, this will suit our style in the last third. I am not sure Hook suits our style if we are going to play route 1 in the centre and would consider him at 15.

Concerned Bok back row will suck Philipps into physical battle when what we need is TK quick ball. JD and JR must hit that first phase breakdown time after time to let our back row and back three in.

Yes it will be Byrne and probably should be the 1/2p but he will figure.

Byrne just has to hit the line and field the kicking assault i expect to bombard him

If adam is fit our scrum should be ok, Ryan is no ball carrier at 8 and that is a worry but he is good leader, experienced and gives us a line out option. (which is vital against matfield)

Toby F is a ball carrier but did spill quite a few balls v england in cardiff and I don't think he is much of a line out option.

We could throw powell into the mix or even play toby f instead of lydiate and have him at 8 when it;s our scrum ball?

I'm not a phillips fan but he played well in the warm up games so who knows?

Priestland roberts and hook looks a better balanced midfield than hook roberts and davies to me.

I'd start with those 3 and have davies on the bench so we can always adjust if it isn't working

we won;t beat the boks playing 10 men rugby or by using two crash ball centres.

a 15 man game is the best option for us

Yes likewise Priestland is inexperienced and i just can't see him starting.

I think a Priestland/Roberts/Hook midfield would be more creative than hook/JR/JD but i reckon WG will pick hook at 10 which means JD/JR pick themselves.

Also like a TF/RJ/SW back row, nice one. But DL does his job like richard hill, quietly but very effectively

Toby F should not play against SA he was rubbish against England in both games losing the ball at the back of the scrums showing no control and how many times did he drop the ball and is not a great line out option because he can't catch the ball, pretty basic for a number 8. He looks more like a 6 to me as he tackles well and quick around the park. R Jones came on and gave Wales control and composure almost making a try for Warburton and assisted North's try. For me it is a no brainer, R Jones to play 8 and I hate to say it Powell to cover from the bench.

glamorganalun wrote:Toby F should not play against SA he was rubbish against England in both games losing the ball at the back of the scrums showing no control and how many times did he drop the ball and is not a great line out option because he can't catch the ball, pretty basic for a number 8. He looks more like a 6 to me as he tackles well and quick around the park. R Jones came on and gave Wales control and composure almost making a try for Warburton and assisted North's try. For me it is a no brainer, R Jones to play 8 and I hate to say it Powell to cover from the bench.

I completely agree, R.Jones played better than Faletau off the bench. Faletau knocked on too many times and made too many errors, we cant throw ball away against SA.

glamorganalun wrote:Toby F should not play against SA he was rubbish against England in both games losing the ball at the back of the scrums showing no control and how many times did he drop the ball and is not a great line out option because he can't catch the ball, pretty basic for a number 8. He looks more like a 6 to me as he tackles well and quick around the park. R Jones came on and gave Wales control and composure almost making a try for Warburton and assisted North's try. For me it is a no brainer, R Jones to play 8 and I hate to say it Powell to cover from the bench.

Oh no not Powell, anything but that

Steady on. Faletau did do lots of good things in those games too. I mean. Can anyone remember the last time R.jones actually carried any ball that didn't go towards either touchhole. Jones will play and I would start him purely on experience. Faletau s one for the future. He's 20. He made his 1st appearance Only 2 months ago and when you think his other 2 games have been behind a stuffed welsh pack against a formidable English pack. He coped admirably. Just ask Barry John. He along with many others has been full of praise for Toby.
If Toby had been given more game time in the last year, rather than 3 games just before the WC, then who knows.
It says it all about gatland's preparation that we'll end up playing an 8 who hasnt got over the gain line since 2005. He i'sn't 1st choice 8 for his region!he'll get through loads of work. He always does, but he moves like a morbidly obese american child. Dreadful. Just dreadful.
Never mind. When they drag his sorry arse off the field, we'll have Andy sloth Powell to come on.

Channel 5 have announced that Andy Powell has been lined up to be the batchelor in their 2nd series. But so far only his mum has applied.

Hang on.... And Susan Boyle!