Welsh Probables v Possibles to take place on 30th May

First topic message reminder :

At the Liberty Stadium according to Twitter. Not seen it elsewhere yet.

Will be interesting to see who is available for selection and who they think are possibles

From a Dragon's point of view I'd like to see Amos, Rees, Lewis Evans, Cudd, Dixon and Tyler Morgan given a run.

Jordan Williams needs a run too ! Would like to see Gavlar too, shirts and skins, swit swoooo   

EDIT

Its yer

http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/30400.php

From the squads and from what Gatland has said about picking the best xv, then the second best and then mixing it up, I think we will get

Jenkins, Owens, Jones, AWJ, Charteris, Lydiate, Navidi (though I think he may go Lydiate 7, Jones 6), Faletau, Phillips, Biggar, North, Roberts, Davies, Cuthbert, Williams

James, Rees, Jones, Davies, Evans, Cook/Coombs, Turnbull, Baker, Davies, Hook, Robinson, Allen, Spratt (or maybe a 10/12 option instead), Prydie, Williams

jimmyinthewell68 wrote:bedfordWelsh i would say if tips was on a central contract it would be up to the WRU but hes being paid by ospreys so they would want him to have the op off season .

Does the player have a say though?

Tipuric's op must have been immediately necessary and he would have been aware that his size would have been an issue v SA…horses for courses and though the hard turf on the veldt might have suited him, the physicality wouldn't….our back row will be Lydiate Faletau and Davies.

God help us if Davies if used in the backrow especially with Ryan Jones touring, it will be as bad if not worse than when Jenkins played AWJ in the backrow.

I would though be happy to see Lydiate Baker and Faletau

Ryan might well bench to cover lock 6 and 8and his experience will be key with Warbs out, i just think it's too soon for Baker. Davies is an aggressive lump so i think they will go with him.

I just think it would be a huge mistake to put Davies there especially when you have Jones and Shingler in the squad both of which having played there at this level for us.

With no A Team when is the right time for Baker, I would much rather see us use this opportunity to experiement with the youngsters such as Baker rather than use a stop gap like Davies.

bedfordwelsh wrote:I just think it would be a huge mistake to put Davies there especially when you have Jones and Shingler  in the squad both of which having played there at this level for us.

With no A Team when is the right time for Baker, I would much rather see us use this opportunity to experiement with the youngsters such as Baker rather than use a stop gap like Davies.

true but not v SA, v italy and Scotland.

Davies won 7s player of the year, but how good is he at the 15 game?

Seagultaf wrote:

Scrumpy wrote:Any Celebs or retired players taking part?

Yes, Henson!!!!!

or maybe not.

"Henson unavailable for Welsh trial

Bath duo Gavin Henson and Paul James will not be available for Wales' Possibles v Probables match on May 30.

The match falls outside of the agreed international Test window and Premier Rugby policy prevents clubs from allowing players to run out for their countries in that instance. As a result, Bath will fall in line with PRL regulations and James and Henson will be available for Wales duty from June 1, a Bath spokesperson confirmed to ESPN.

Earlier this week, a PRL spokesperson explained their stance over international release, saying: "Premiership Rugby has a policy to only release non-England players under the conditions of the International Rugby Board's regulation nine. This regulation covers international release for every Test country across the world. This trial match does not fall under IRB regulation nine."

The news will come as a blow for Henson's Test prospects with him being named in the 'Probables' squad. Wales boss Warren Gatland said on Tuesday he will be reluctant to pick those not involved in the trial match.

"If they are not involved it makes if difficult for us to select them," Gatland said. "And, going forward, we might potentially have to review the policy of picking English-based players if they are not available to us."

Read more at http://www.espnscrum.com/wales/rugby/story/225427.html#zci8Ze2YvH5yGJkU.99

Its a shame but rules are rules.

Maybe if Gatland and the WRU asked nicely then clubs like Bath would be more willing to release their players.

Isn't it a bit short-sighted of the English clubs? It may make young Welsh players with international ambitions that bit less likely to go over the bridge in the future.

No not really.

If the WRU stick to the IRB window rules then there isn't a problem.

Why is there a problem with certain players being released if they have nothing to do ?

This is down to PRL, not the clubs mind you. The Saints were a little less jobsworth about this 'rule' though and let George go for Wales duty

i think English clubs using this rule to disrupt the Welsh preparation for next years world cup   

I agree Munk I'd let them go once there is nothing to play for, but there must be bad blood between these guys so PRL they will be sticking to the rules.   

Saints/North have it in his contract, allegedly!

Remember when we needed Paul James and Bath agreed as it would have suited them but the PRL interjected ? I'm guessing you could have had a whip round in the clubhouse and pay the £60k fine but should you have have to ?

Maybe Bruce will pay?  

60k is pocket money to him.

The RFU pays the PRL for access to players outside the international window. If the WRU wants access to players outside the window, they know who to call.

They aren't going to win any friends by making unilateral announcements.

Scrumpy wrote:No not really.

If the WRU stick to the IRB window rules then there isn't a problem.

Indeed.

jimmyinthewell68 wrote:i think English clubs using this rule to disrupt the Welsh preparation for next years  world cup   

I reckon we're doing a damn fine job on our own without the help of the English clubs.

Rugby Fan wrote:The RFU pays the PRL for access to players outside the international window. If the WRU wants access to players outside the window, they know who to call.

They aren't going to win any friends by making unilateral announcements.

As do the WRU, for Wales based players under the soon to expire, PA. About a tenner each I think.   

IronMike wrote:Davies won 7s player of the year, but how good is he at the 15 game?

IM,

Am on about Bradely Davies, rumours are they gonna play him in the back row and scratch sorry if coaches think players are good enough then pick no matter what team.

Scrumpy wrote:No not really.

If the WRU stick to the IRB window rules then there isn't a problem.

Aye, it's almost as big a mess as the England tour of NZ, but not quite.

bedfordwelsh wrote:

IronMike wrote:Davies won 7s player of the year, but how good is he at the 15 game?

IM,

Am on about Bradely Davies, rumours are they gonna play him in the back row and scratch sorry if coaches think players are good enough then pick no matter what team.

you are right of course but not in a weakened back row. You have to ease our players into internationals, our regional game is inadequate preparation

Scratch wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:

IronMike wrote:Davies won 7s player of the year, but how good is he at the 15 game?

IM,

Am on about Bradely Davies, rumours are they gonna play him in the back row and scratch sorry if coaches think players are good enough then pick no matter what team.

you are right of course but not in a weakened back row. You have to ease our players into internationals, our regional game is inadequate preparation

Would it be a weakened backrow though if Lydiate and Faletau were playing? I would still rather put an untried player like Baker in, who at least plays in the backrow instead of a 2nd rower like Davies.

When you look at the squad then with the exception of R Jones all other options are either untried or not had that many games such as Shingler.

Lydiate 6, Faletau 7 and Baker or R Jones at 8

munkian wrote:Lydiate 6, Faletau 7 and Baker or R Jones at 8

Munkian,

I would be happy with that, start Ryan possibly then give Baker some good gametime off the bench.

 

The excitement is wearing off now is it?

bedfordwelsh wrote:

Scratch wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:

IronMike wrote:Davies won 7s player of the year, but how good is he at the 15 game?

IM,

Am on about Bradely Davies, rumours are they gonna play him in the back row and scratch sorry if coaches think players are good enough then pick no matter what team.

you are right of course but not in a weakened back row. You have to ease our players into internationals, our regional game is inadequate preparation

Would it be a weakened backrow though if Lydiate and Faletau were playing?  I would still rather put an untried player like Baker in, who at least plays in the backrow instead of a 2nd rower like Davies.

When you look at the squad then with the exception of R Jones all other options are either untried or not had that many games such as Shingler.

This. I'd rather play inexperience in the right position than experience in the wrong one. And for the experience that he does have, Davies really hasn't shown the attributes to make a good competent back row... let alone against one of the world's toughest back rows. Baker meanwhile has shown the initial features of a very promising no.8, particularly his go-forward with ball in hand. He gave the same impressions while playing for the u20's. And as long as he has experience playing around him, I'm not that worried. It'd be good to have him challenging Faletau in future squads, 8 is one of those positions where we most lack established competitive depth.

Rugby Fan wrote:The RFU pays the PRL for access to players outside the international window. If the WRU wants access to players outside the window, they know who to call.

They aren't going to win any friends by making unilateral announcements.

Also, the RFU tend to only utilse England based players so why don't the WRU do the same?

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:The RFU pays the PRL for access to players outside the international window. If the WRU wants access to players outside the window, they know who to call.

They aren't going to win any friends by making unilateral announcements.

Also, the RFU tend to only utilse England based players so why don't the WRU do the same?

Simple - Money!

England is a big country (54M people) with a growing economy, Wales is a small country (3M people) with a broke economy. Rodger the Dodger and his self serving policies also does not help. But like in football, it simply comes down to money.

Would it not be sensible to have the probable bench be in the possible XV?

It looks like Ryan is out of the trial as he will be involved with the play off finals, he may cover the bench for the probables.

Nematode wrote:Would it not be sensible to have the probable bench be in the possible XV?

That sounds like a poser out of a logic exam.

It probably is

Surely WG has to change his tactics/bring in new players soon? When was the last time you beat SA/Aus? If you want to win the RWC, or even get out of your group, something surely needs to change to beat Australia and England?

Seems odd the likes of Dan Baker, Gareth Davies, Owen Williams aren't being talked of starting as from the rabo/aviva they're playing regularly and are in form, unlike Phillips & Lydiate.

Owen Williams' chances of a part to play in the summer tour must have just shot up considerably with Priestland's injury (a blessing in disguise surely!) and Tigers' elimination from the play-offs.

He's been cited for foul play though

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/owen-williams-cited-alleged-contact-7137030

First I've heard of this. It'll probably pend on the outcome of the hearing then. With the first test under a month away a ban is more likely to do his chances some harm if not end them altogether. Any deliberate contact with the eye area merits a hefty ban without question in my eyes (no pun intended), though it will drop us in a precarious position in terms of fly-halves.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo8IGtAUoAQ&feature=youtu.be

About 1:25:04, or 63:20 on the match clock.

Doesn't appear to be much in it to be honest. His hands and Burrell's head are in the ruck area, there is a little grappling and pushing and that's all I can see. Can't see any attempt at the eyes, beyond his hands just being in the vicinity.

Very hard to draw any conclusions from that. Burrell looked miffed and had a few words straight afterwards though.

All this citing business is getting a bit silly, Ashton is in trouble for shouting during the opposition's penalty kick.

I hate to say it but it's subtle instances of foul play such as this when citing is most useful. Not to say for certain that Williams made deliberate contact with the face/eye area yet but if he did, he'll deserve a ban. I'd be disappointed in him if he did just as I would in anyone else putting fingers where they don't belong, although frequency has gone down since the IRB clamped down on gouging it remains one of the most disgusting acts in the game.

munkian wrote:All this citing business is getting a bit silly, Ashton is in trouble for shouting during the opposition's penalty kick.

 
That's just not cricket old boy... He should serve a life ban for that sort of waggish behaviour.... Actually life ban is too lenient, he should have his todger smeared with treacle and with y fronts around his ankles and arms tied behind his back, he should be placed face down near the ants nest in the local park...  

Any news on who will be replacing the English based players who can't play?

Will North play for Northampton in the Premiership Final? If so who will be drafted in? Dirksen, Tyler Morgan, ????

I cant really see why other English players wont be released as their season is finished, but if they are who will replace: Paul James, Henson, Owen Williams, etc?

Greater Bok squad announced today:

http://mobi.supersport.com/rugby/springboks/news/140519/Brussow_joins_Schalk_in_extended_squad

Many injuries (Eben Etsebeth, Jacques Fourie, PS du Toit and Lambie being the most relevant) and no EU based players available for selection which rules out Habana, Bakkis, Louw etc

Good to see Schalk back and Marcel Coetzee is improving quickly under J White as has F Steyn.

Great to see Brussow back, the guy that spoiled our party at RWC 2011  

Scratch wrote:Great to see Brussow back, the guy that spoiled our party at RWC 2011  

Seem to remember Warburton getting the better of him in our game vs SA in the world cup

IronMike wrote:

Scratch wrote:Great to see Brussow back, the guy that spoiled our party at RWC 2011  

Seem to remember Warburton getting the better of him in our game vs SA in the world cup

I recall a different story but you might be right, think he was also involved in the Lions defeat which may be what i am remembering. Anyway I always rated him and am assuming injury has kept him out for so long

Scratch wrote:

IronMike wrote:

Scratch wrote:Great to see Brussow back, the guy that spoiled our party at RWC 2011  

Seem to remember Warburton getting the better of him in our game vs SA in the world cup

I recall a different story but you might be right, think he was also involved in the Lions defeat which may be what i am remembering. Anyway I always rated him and am assuming injury has kept him out for so long

Brussow really hit the scene during the Lions in 09 when he was on fire. In 2011 Warbs was shutting him out of just about every ruck. Hougaard's try under the posts and the crucial one-point margin it gave the Boks was really what did us that year.